Sacred learning is necessary in a minister of the church but sanctity is nct less necessary. Nothing is so eloquent, or so powerfully persuasive as example. A learned man may convince, but to convert souls is chiefly the privilege of those that are pious. There have been few ages in which polite literature has been cultivated with greater ardor than the present wherein we live. How many great orators, how many elegant writers have made their appearance in it! If these were all saints, what a reformation of manners should we see among the people! It is sanctity that possesses the art of softening the heart, and subduing all the powers of the soul.
An edifying life proves the preacher sincere, and is alone a sermon which obstinacy itself will find it hard to hold out against. It stops the mouth of the enemies of truth and virtue. The life, vigor, and justness of a discourse, are the fruit of wit, genius, and study; but unction in words is produced only by the heart, A man must be animated with the spirit of God to speak powerfully on divine things; the conversion of hearts is the work of God.
A father and a mother are surprised that their instructions seem thrown away upon their children but let them remember, that if they spoke the language of men and angels, if they have not themselves charity, or true piety, they are only a sounding trumpet. Children, in their most tender infancy, observe with incredible penetration and sagacity every word and action of others, especially of those whom they revere and love. In these, they naturally discern and read the spirit of all the passions with which such persons are actuated, deeply imbibe the same, learn to think and act from them, and are entirely molded upon this model. The children of worldly parents will probably differ from them only in this, that their passions, by being strengthened so early, will become with age more blind and headstrong
But afters years of interacting with 'trads' either online or in person I am severely disappointed again and again.
When I first became a traditional Catholic I had assumed that traditional Catholics would be strong and zealous to obey God and keep traditional Catholic teaching. But afters years of interacting with 'trads' either online or in person I am severely disappointed again and again. Most trads do not follow Church authority, when presented with infallible Catholic doctrines instead of meekly and joyfully submitting to God's command they instead justify disobedience by quoting men, regardless if these men are saints, doctors and theologians. This inordinate order of authority is essentially protestantism. Catholics obey what the Church teaches because the Church is the authority that God left on earth to teach and guide us to heaven. Yet so many trads pick and choose when it comes to things that effect them personally. I don't understand this, why not simply obey the proper ORDER of authority? Why deny Papal definitions? Why squirm out of dogmatic councils and decrees? Why is it the response is always "oh saint xyz said this contrary thing to this Pope/Council so I will obey saint xyz instead of said Pope/Council", this is ridiculous! It's not ju. st laypeople who do this, but the traditional clergy nearly all do this. Whether it be the SSPX with their false obedience to the man they claim is Pope while denying the Church's indefectibility, falsely believing that the new rites of Bishops and Priests are all fine and dandy at the expensive of the faithful, or the sedes with their contradictory denial that V2 is a false council that taught error/heresy while believing and quoting the very docuмent that V2 used to deny EENS and 'Pope' Sanborn with his nonsense authority with una cuм and denial of sacraments for those who believe in baptism and EENS, or with the resistance, I don't even know what's happening since Bishop Williamson died, they seem to be in stasis, just kinda there in limbo doing the same as usual. But each "group" (and others not mentioned) all have fundamental problems. I am not shocked that the faithful exemplify the behaviour of the clergy. Clergymen saying it's ok to vote for an evil man because he is less evil than the (((opposition))), clergymen denying Noah's flood, promoting evolution and other heretical garbage and not being punishment by his superiors. Is it any surprise the crisis in the Church has not improved over the last 60 years and instead has gotten worse?Oh, cry me a river :'(
And there is also the different trad responses to covid and taking the gene therapy...
You have trads who think feminism is fine, that women can dress immodestly, that women can disobey their fathers/husbands and go to college and get into debt!. 'Trads' who think women should wait until they are 25+ to get married because of Jєωιѕн propaganda on "brain development" and "maturity" (women do not mature like men, this is insane), that age gaps are bad and you are a pedo if you like younger women, (she was 17 yr old and 364 days you sick freak!), "oh your much older than her, you have too much power over her" :facepalm:, it's really amazing how retarded some 'trads' are. A man ALWAYS has power over his women, because that's simply the order that God has made. Yes men are more rational, more physically capable, more emotionally stable than women and many other things, this isn't a bad thing. It's simply how God has made us, but some 'trads' do not like this, they think men and women are equal, that women are just as capable as men. It's rubbish, absolute and utter garbage. The more that is given to you the more that is expected from you, God gave men more capabilities so men have more responsibilities as a consequence. So it's not strange that the man needs more time than the women to get married, he has more responsibility, he is the leader yet for some strange reason 'trad' men and women, even clergymen will say regurgitate Jєωιѕн feminist nonsense. A man is the head of the house, a woman it's heart. Bishop Williamson said that a man needs to be a straight pole in the ground so the woman the vine and wrap around him and grow upwards, yet so many don't want to submit to their husbands. So many 'trads' will deny scripture about a woman's duty to her husband, whether it be the marriage debt, obedience and other things. Even when you quote great Saints like St Thomas the trad feminists call you a sleezebag. Imagine if men called women names if they said that husband should love their wives like Christ loved the Church. I've seen on this forum a young lady saying she was felt a lot of pressure to get married, she was around ~22. Well it's not surprising, women do not age like men in terms of fertility, 22 is already late in my opinion so why does this girl and other feel this way? Is there no men up to their standards? Are they unwilling to marry an older man? Did their parents not properly raise them to be ready for marriage by ~18? It doesn't help that these girls do not explain why they feel this way so people can understand their perspective.
There is also boomer trads who think the economy is fine. People who just don't understand how younger men got shafted hard by diversity hiring and other Jєωιѕн garbage. "oh just pull yourself up by the bootstraps and work hard and stop complaining all the time". Men will come online to complain because in reality most men are POWERLESS. They have no real recourse to fix their situations. If a man is in his teens he can still manage if he works hard for 20+ years while living with his parents, just when his is ready for marriage with a house paid off and a career he will be in his 30s and his marriage options will be limited because brainwashing about age gaps mentioned previously. Now most guys are not working hard from their teens, usually it's in their 20s that most men will start to panic and realise that things are going the way they had hoped. For these men (and it's most men) they won't be able to marry (assuming they do things 'properly' from a Catholic courtship perspective) until they are in their late 30s and 40s. Yet most girls in their early to mid 20s don't want to marry these older men, even though it should be considered normal from a Catholic viewpoint.
This long article goes into the bullcrap white men have had to deal with since about 2014, men simply would not get hired because they were white, because they were a man, and because they weren't some ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ abomination.
https://www.compactmag.com/article/the-lost-generation/
Some will say these men should just do a trade job but not every man is cut out for a labor job, it's just how it is, likewise some tradesmen are not cut out for deskjobs.
In becoming a trad I had hoped that trads would be more disciplined that the average secular person and in most things they are. Most trads to not commit the same sins as secular people however there are certain things that disappoint me greatly that I did not expect. I've seen an incredible amount of trads who are overweight. it's really something. You would think mortification and fasting would keep trads slim and healthy, that they would know better since their body is temple for God and it should be keep pure body in body and soul. But no, I see obese, morbidly obese and beyond trads more than I do see slim and healthy trads. Trad wives with feminist style makeup (especially the lipstick urgh) whose daughters also wear this makeup (even 12yr old girls with heavy makeup :fryingpan:), girls who dress immodestly, whether it be tight clothing, clothes that are too short, clothes that are transparent, clothes with a slit on the legs, yet not a word from the pulpit about gluttony and immodesty in dress. Young ladies who mannerism leave much to be desired in terms of femininity, such as talking in a masculine manner, sitting with spread legs, being rude and disrespectful to men, listening to modern music :facepalm:. I have seen teenage girls with tattoos much to the dismay of the father (this indicates that the wife is the problem), teenage girls with nose piercing and lots of earrings, with fake dyed hair and having boyfriends and thinking it's okay to have relationships (I disagree, if it's not courtship it's not okay).
You have trad feminists online who claim to be Catholic/Christian yet they far from God because they deny His natural order between men and women. Some of these women think it's okay to date multiple men at the same time, and if you claim you will only marry a virgin they get very upset. I've had very pro EENS girls block me because I quoted the Dimonds here and there because apparently I am not extremely enough, must be pro EENS while also denouncing others for their personal faults :clown:.
I've had trads get upset at me for quoting Catholic theologians on healthy racism, because I am somehow a bad person because I don't want to race mix and destroy my bloondline and make my children struggle with all the issues that come with being mixed race :jester:. Because white people aren't allowed to have their own nations and their governments aren't allowed to put the native whites first over the non-white immigrants, even though the Catholic authority says otherwise.
I know I can only accept the tribulations that God sends me with patience and resignation. But am I so tired of all the hypocrisy from modern trads, they refuse recognise and obey the proper authority and order of authority that God has sent down. They have little charity when you aren't as extreme as them in certain positions. They don't acknowledge the differences between men and women or understand how much effort and time it requires to be a man capable of providing and leading a family, that when a man does achieve these things he must marry someone close to his age who may not even be able to give him children (I know trad couples with no children, I can't say why for certain but I would wager it's because the women wasn't young). I know a young man who married a fat women, and within months of being married she is now much larger than she was before. I know ladies who wear makeup and like secular music. I know priests who say a women shouldn't get married until 25 because of brain development and maturity.
Frankly I am tired and only getting older with each passing day, I do try to work hard and prepare myself so I can one day marry and raise Godly children, yet at every-turn I find opposition from those who are supposed to be my fellow brothers and sisters in Christ. I would have thought they would have some empathy and understanding to the struggle of the young instead it's usually a lecture and some propaganda about not being mature or working hard enough or not being man enough due to 'complaining' about these issues (or I could call it bringing up faults that need to be addressed and fixed). People who just don't seem to care. I don't want to ladies to grow old alone and miserable, I want them to marry young and be happy, even if that requires marrying an older man. I want the clergymen to actually accept Catholic dogma and have proper obedience to God and His Church, not picking and choosing because they don't care enough about the salvation of the faithful and would rather compromise with the enemy in Rome. I want the husbands to have Godly wives who are obedient to them in all things (bar sin), and wives to have loving husbands who don't abuse their authority. If I didn't care it would be much easier, but because I do care it's so much more difficult, seeing the state of things and frankly I do not believe that most trads will save their souls.
I do wish to love my (future) wife as Christ loved the Church, but I also expect obedience. I won't be compromising on Catholic doctrines, or my (basic) standards for women. I won't buckle under boomer delusion or Jєωιѕн propaganda. But realistically what can I do? Most of the women at my chapel are not ladies I would consider marrying, either because they aren't white, or they are fat, or they have tattoos, or took the covid injection, or they are not feminine or because they don't believe in EENS properly. My labor only pays me so much, or rather so little, in comparison to housing. By the time I am ready most of these girls will be too old for me to consider as I want to realistically have children and marrying an old women who may or may not give me children due to her lowered fertility is a risk factor I cannot ignore. The fact is these girls should already be looking for a husband while they are young, not waiting for 25 to hit before they even begin, and certainly not dismissing an older man simply because is old...
Now for those who will say that many people aren't called to the married life, just remember that the family unit is the most basic structure of society. If your sons and daughters cannot get married and have offspring for whatever reason, this is a SERIOUS problem that cannot be ignored. But from what I've seen most do not care, that's why this topic keep coming up over and over again on this forum and other website, because it's a foundational issue.
This post is not simply about women and feminists, not simply about the clergy and laypeople with inordinate obedience to God. It's the overall encompassing denial of reality that seems to be effecting trads. Trads who refuse to acknowledge that being a Catholic means being different from those who live in the world, so why do so many trads say the times have changed and want to deny how things were done in the past when it suits them? I could go on and on but I have already said enough.
Oh, cry me a river :'(Ok boomer, you are clearly what OP meant by fake lukewarm trads.
Billions didn't even have a chance at life (see global abortion & contraception stats for the last 100 years)
Quit wasting the life God gave you & G.T.F.U.
Oh, cry me a river :'(Why don't you expanded on how OP can quit wasting their life? They already are Catholic and work, what more do you expect them to do?
Billions didn't even have a chance at life (see global abortion & contraception stats for the last 100 years)
Quit wasting the life God gave you & G.T.F.U.
One can deduce a few things just from the fact that you are here on CathInfo:I swear some of you have ZERO reading comprehension, OP said
1) You are not literally starving to death.
2) You have some functional level of literacy.
3) You have an internet connection and time to use it.
Millions, in the here and now, don't have even those things. Are you grateful? Do you use your internet access for anything good, or do you just keep wasting it?
Instead of wallowing in self pity, composing litanies of how hard your life is, how about spend equal time listing things to be grateful for?
I do actually feel compassion for you, but it does no good to express it. You don't use the compassion to help yourself up, you ABUSE it, use it as an excuse to keep on with the nonsense. Your attitude is disgusting. It shouts, "I'M A SPOILED BRAT WHO REFUSES TO GROW UP!!!" Isn't that really why you spend so much time here; your shitty attitude gets condoned, at times even praised? I'm not interested in enabling that.
How long before you realize that your life is just that, YOUR LIFE?
Some time back it was recommended that you seek professional help. I can't say that that advice was wrong. Hard as it may be to admit, your biggest problems might be yours, and not due to everyone and everything outside yourself.
I've been assuming all this time that you're being genuine. I hope that you are but, in the interests of honesty, I have to say that I have begun to consider the possibility that you are some kind of deep troll or agent.
I know I can only accept the tribulations that God sends me with patience and resignation.
Some time back it was recommended that you seek professional help. I can't say that that advice was wrong. Hard as it may be to admit, your biggest problems might be yours, and not due to everyone and everything outside yourself.Terrible advice. Professional help, aka therapy is a Jєωιѕн scam.
One can deduce a few things just from the fact that you are here on CathInfo:"Yeah bro you are fine you're not starving to death."
1) You are not literally starving to death.
2) You have some functional level of literacy.
3) You have an internet connection and time to use it.
Millions, in the here and now, don't have even those things. Are you grateful? Do you use your internet access for anything good, or do you just keep wasting it?
Instead of wallowing in self pity, composing litanies of how hard your life is, how about spend equal time listing things to be grateful for?
I do actually feel compassion for you, but it does no good to express it. You don't use the compassion to help yourself up, you ABUSE it, use it as an excuse to keep on with the nonsense. Your attitude is disgusting. It shouts, "I'M A SPOILED BRAT WHO REFUSES TO GROW UP!!!" Isn't that really why you spend so much time here; your shitty attitude gets condoned, at times even praised? I'm not interested in enabling that.
How long before you realize that your life is just that, YOUR LIFE?
Some time back it was recommended that you seek professional help. I can't say that that advice was wrong. Hard as it may be to admit, your biggest problems might be yours, and not due to everyone and everything outside yourself.
I've been assuming all this time that you're being genuine. I hope that you are but, in the interests of honesty, I have to say that I have begun to consider the possibility that you are some kind of deep troll or agent.
When I first became a traditional Catholic I had assumed that traditional Catholics would be strong and zealous to obey God and keep traditional Catholic teaching. But afters years of interacting with 'trads' either online or in person I am severely disappointed again and again.Trads are people as well who suffer from the effects of original sin. They aren't perfect and some of them are lacking compared to converts due to growing up with the faith, there are things you learn better by comparison with life experience, converts usually care more about the faith because of the circuмstances they are in before they convert. That isn't to say Cradle Catholic trads don't know anything or don't care but the perspective is different. Some care more than others and will take the time to learn, also the parents are a big factor in this. It doesn't help that the clergy have petty squabbles setting a bad example. Have compassion on your neighbour, they are flawed just like yourself.
Most trads do not follow Church authority, when presented with infallible Catholic doctrines instead of meekly and joyfully submitting to God's command they instead justify disobedience by quoting men, regardless if these men are saints, doctors and theologians. This inordinate order of authority is essentially protestantism. Catholics obey what the Church teaches because the Church is the authority that God left on earth to teach and guide us to heaven. Yet so many trads pick and choose when it comes to things that effect them personally. I don't understand this, why not simply obey the proper ORDER of authority? Why deny Papal definitions? Why squirm out of dogmatic councils and decrees? Why is it the response is always "oh saint xyz said this contrary thing to this Pope/Council so I will obey saint xyz instead of said Pope/Council", this is ridiculous! It's not ju. st laypeople who do this, but the traditional clergy nearly all do this. Whether it be the SSPX with their false obedience to the man they claim is Pope while denying the Church's indefectibility, falsely believing that the new rites of Bishops and Priests are all fine and dandy at the expensive of the faithful, or the sedes with their contradictory denial that V2 is a false council that taught error/heresy while believing and quoting the very docuмent that V2 used to deny EENS and 'Pope' Sanborn with his nonsense authority with una cuм and denial of sacraments for those who believe in baptism and EENS, or with the resistance, I don't even know what's happening since Bishop Williamson died, they seem to be in stasis, just kinda there in limbo doing the same as usual. But each "group" (and others not mentioned) all have fundamental problems. I am not shocked that the faithful exemplify the behaviour of the clergy. Clergymen saying it's ok to vote for an evil man because he is less evil than the (((opposition))), clergymen denying Noah's flood, promoting evolution and other heretical garbage and not being punishment by his superiors. Is it any surprise the crisis in the Church has not improved over the last 60 years and instead has gotten worse?
And there is also the different trad responses to covid and taking the gene therapy...
You have trads who think feminism is fine, that women can dress immodestly, that women can disobey their fathers/husbands and go to college and get into debt!. 'Trads' who think women should wait until they are 25+ to get married because of Jєωιѕн propaganda on "brain development" and "maturity" (women do not mature like men, this is insane), that age gaps are bad and you are a pedo if you like younger women, (she was 17 yr old and 364 days you sick freak!), "oh your much older than her, you have too much power over her" :facepalm:, it's really amazing how retarded some 'trads' are. A man ALWAYS has power over his women, because that's simply the order that God has made. Yes men are more rational, more physically capable, more emotionally stable than women and many other things, this isn't a bad thing. It's simply how God has made us, but some 'trads' do not like this, they think men and women are equal, that women are just as capable as men. It's rubbish, absolute and utter garbage. The more that is given to you the more that is expected from you, God gave men more capabilities so men have more responsibilities as a consequence. So it's not strange that the man needs more time than the women to get married, he has more responsibility, he is the leader yet for some strange reason 'trad' men and women, even clergymen will say regurgitate Jєωιѕн feminist nonsense. A man is the head of the house, a woman it's heart. Bishop Williamson said that a man needs to be a straight pole in the ground so the woman the vine and wrap around him and grow upwards, yet so many don't want to submit to their husbands. So many 'trads' will deny scripture about a woman's duty to her husband, whether it be the marriage debt, obedience and other things. Even when you quote great Saints like St Thomas the trad feminists call you a sleezebag. Imagine if men called women names if they said that husband should love their wives like Christ loved the Church. I've seen on this forum a young lady saying she was felt a lot of pressure to get married, she was around ~22. Well it's not surprising, women do not age like men in terms of fertility, 22 is already late in my opinion so why does this girl and other feel this way? Is there no men up to their standards? Are they unwilling to marry an older man? Did their parents not properly raise them to be ready for marriage by ~18? It doesn't help that these girls do not explain why they feel this way so people can understand their perspective.
There is also boomer trads who think the economy is fine. People who just don't understand how younger men got shafted hard by diversity hiring and other Jєωιѕн garbage. "oh just pull yourself up by the bootstraps and work hard and stop complaining all the time". Men will come online to complain because in reality most men are POWERLESS. They have no real recourse to fix their situations. If a man is in his teens he can still manage if he works hard for 20+ years while living with his parents, just when his is ready for marriage with a house paid off and a career he will be in his 30s and his marriage options will be limited because brainwashing about age gaps mentioned previously. Now most guys are not working hard from their teens, usually it's in their 20s that most men will start to panic and realise that things are going the way they had hoped. For these men (and it's most men) they won't be able to marry (assuming they do things 'properly' from a Catholic courtship perspective) until they are in their late 30s and 40s. Yet most girls in their early to mid 20s don't want to marry these older men, even though it should be considered normal from a Catholic viewpoint.
This long article goes into the bullcrap white men have had to deal with since about 2014, men simply would not get hired because they were white, because they were a man, and because they weren't some ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ abomination.
https://www.compactmag.com/article/the-lost-generation/
Some will say these men should just do a trade job but not every man is cut out for a labor job, it's just how it is, likewise some tradesmen are not cut out for deskjobs.
In becoming a trad I had hoped that trads would be more disciplined that the average secular person and in most things they are. Most trads to not commit the same sins as secular people however there are certain things that disappoint me greatly that I did not expect. I've seen an incredible amount of trads who are overweight. it's really something. You would think mortification and fasting would keep trads slim and healthy, that they would know better since their body is temple for God and it should be keep pure body in body and soul. But no, I see obese, morbidly obese and beyond trads more than I do see slim and healthy trads. Trad wives with feminist style makeup (especially the lipstick urgh) whose daughters also wear this makeup (even 12yr old girls with heavy makeup :fryingpan:), girls who dress immodestly, whether it be tight clothing, clothes that are too short, clothes that are transparent, clothes with a slit on the legs, yet not a word from the pulpit about gluttony and immodesty in dress. Young ladies who mannerism leave much to be desired in terms of femininity, such as talking in a masculine manner, sitting with spread legs, being rude and disrespectful to men, listening to modern music :facepalm:. I have seen teenage girls with tattoos much to the dismay of the father (this indicates that the wife is the problem), teenage girls with nose piercing and lots of earrings, with fake dyed hair and having boyfriends and thinking it's okay to have relationships (I disagree, if it's not courtship it's not okay).
You have trad feminists online who claim to be Catholic/Christian yet they far from God because they deny His natural order between men and women. Some of these women think it's okay to date multiple men at the same time, and if you claim you will only marry a virgin they get very upset. I've had very pro EENS girls block me because I quoted the Dimonds here and there because apparently I am not extremely enough, must be pro EENS while also denouncing others for their personal faults :clown:.
I've had trads get upset at me for quoting Catholic theologians on healthy racism, because I am somehow a bad person because I don't want to race mix and destroy my bloondline and make my children struggle with all the issues that come with being mixed race :jester:. Because white people aren't allowed to have their own nations and their governments aren't allowed to put the native whites first over the non-white immigrants, even though the Catholic authority says otherwise.
I know I can only accept the tribulations that God sends me with patience and resignation. But am I so tired of all the hypocrisy from modern trads, they refuse recognise and obey the proper authority and order of authority that God has sent down. They have little charity when you aren't as extreme as them in certain positions. They don't acknowledge the differences between men and women or understand how much effort and time it requires to be a man capable of providing and leading a family, that when a man does achieve these things he must marry someone close to his age who may not even be able to give him children (I know trad couples with no children, I can't say why for certain but I would wager it's because the women wasn't young). I know a young man who married a fat women, and within months of being married she is now much larger than she was before. I know ladies who wear makeup and like secular music. I know priests who say a women shouldn't get married until 25 because of brain development and maturity.
Frankly I am tired and only getting older with each passing day, I do try to work hard and prepare myself so I can one day marry and raise Godly children, yet at every-turn I find opposition from those who are supposed to be my fellow brothers and sisters in Christ. I would have thought they would have some empathy and understanding to the struggle of the young instead it's usually a lecture and some propaganda about not being mature or working hard enough or not being man enough due to 'complaining' about these issues (or I could call it bringing up faults that need to be addressed and fixed). People who just don't seem to care. I don't want to ladies to grow old alone and miserable, I want them to marry young and be happy, even if that requires marrying an older man. I want the clergymen to actually accept Catholic dogma and have proper obedience to God and His Church, not picking and choosing because they don't care enough about the salvation of the faithful and would rather compromise with the enemy in Rome. I want the husbands to have Godly wives who are obedient to them in all things (bar sin), and wives to have loving husbands who don't abuse their authority. If I didn't care it would be much easier, but because I do care it's so much more difficult, seeing the state of things and frankly I do not believe that most trads will save their souls.
I do wish to love my (future) wife as Christ loved the Church, but I also expect obedience. I won't be compromising on Catholic doctrines, or my (basic) standards for women. I won't buckle under boomer delusion or Jєωιѕн propaganda. But realistically what can I do? Most of the women at my chapel are not ladies I would consider marrying, either because they aren't white, or they are fat, or they have tattoos, or took the covid injection, or they are not feminine or because they don't believe in EENS properly. My labor only pays me so much, or rather so little, in comparison to housing. By the time I am ready most of these girls will be too old for me to consider as I want to realistically have children and marrying an old women who may or may not give me children due to her lowered fertility is a risk factor I cannot ignore. The fact is these girls should already be looking for a husband while they are young, not waiting for 25 to hit before they even begin, and certainly not dismissing an older man simply because is old...
Now for those who will say that many people aren't called to the married life, just remember that the family unit is the most basic structure of society. If your sons and daughters cannot get married and have offspring for whatever reason, this is a SERIOUS problem that cannot be ignored. But from what I've seen most do not care, that's why this topic keep coming up over and over again on this forum and other website, because it's a foundational issue.
This post is not simply about women and feminists, not simply about the clergy and laypeople with inordinate obedience to God. It's the overall encompassing denial of reality that seems to be effecting trads. Trads who refuse to acknowledge that being a Catholic means being different from those who live in the world, so why do so many trads say the times have changed and want to deny how things were done in the past when it suits them? I could go on and on but I have already said enough.
When I first became a traditional Catholic I had assumed that traditional Catholics would be strong and zealous to obey God and keep traditional Catholic teaching. But afters years of interacting with 'trads' either online or in person I am severely disappointed again and again. Most trads do not follow Church authority, when presented with infallible Catholic doctrines instead of meekly and joyfully submitting to God's command they instead justify disobedience by quoting men, regardless if these men are saints, doctors and theologians. This inordinate order of authority is essentially protestantism. Catholics obey what the Church teaches because the Church is the authority that God left on earth to teach and guide us to heaven. Yet so many trads pick and choose when it comes to things that effect them personally. I don't understand this, why not simply obey the proper ORDER of authority? Why deny Papal definitions? Why squirm out of dogmatic councils and decrees? Why is it the response is always "oh saint xyz said this contrary thing to this Pope/Council so I will obey saint xyz instead of said Pope/Council", this is ridiculous! It's not ju. st laypeople who do this, but the traditional clergy nearly all do this. Whether it be the SSPX with their false obedience to the man they claim is Pope while denying the Church's indefectibility, falsely believing that the new rites of Bishops and Priests are all fine and dandy at the expensive of the faithful, or the sedes with their contradictory denial that V2 is a false council that taught error/heresy while believing and quoting the very docuмent that V2 used to deny EENS and 'Pope' Sanborn with his nonsense authority with una cuм and denial of sacraments for those who believe in baptism and EENS, or with the resistance, I don't even know what's happening since Bishop Williamson died, they seem to be in stasis, just kinda there in limbo doing the same as usual. But each "group" (and others not mentioned) all have fundamental problems. I am not shocked that the faithful exemplify the behaviour of the clergy. Clergymen saying it's ok to vote for an evil man because he is less evil than the (((opposition))), clergymen denying Noah's flood, promoting evolution and other heretical garbage and not being punishment by his superiors. Is it any surprise the crisis in the Church has not improved over the last 60 years and instead has gotten worse?There are no ‘trads’ just Catholics. Some Catholics attend the traditional Latin Mass. There are faithful Catholics and cafeteria ‘Catholics’ the latter who say things like ‘ok I’m Catholic but I believe in abortion’ Obviously you can’t be Catholic and pro abortion. It is very frustrating but I try to focus just on what I and my family are doing and the immediate influence we can have on others around us. Talk to non Catholic friends about the faith you never know they may laugh but will think about what you’ve said.
And there is also the different trad responses to covid and taking the gene therapy...
You have trads who think feminism is fine, that women can dress immodestly, that women can disobey their fathers/husbands and go to college and get into debt!. 'Trads' who think women should wait until they are 25+ to get married because of Jєωιѕн propaganda on "brain development" and "maturity" (women do not mature like men, this is insane), that age gaps are bad and you are a pedo if you like younger women, (she was 17 yr old and 364 days you sick freak!), "oh your much older than her, you have too much power over her" :facepalm:, it's really amazing how retarded some 'trads' are. A man ALWAYS has power over his women, because that's simply the order that God has made. Yes men are more rational, more physically capable, more emotionally stable than women and many other things, this isn't a bad thing. It's simply how God has made us, but some 'trads' do not like this, they think men and women are equal, that women are just as capable as men. It's rubbish, absolute and utter garbage. The more that is given to you the more that is expected from you, God gave men more capabilities so men have more responsibilities as a consequence. So it's not strange that the man needs more time than the women to get married, he has more responsibility, he is the leader yet for some strange reason 'trad' men and women, even clergymen will say regurgitate Jєωιѕн feminist nonsense. A man is the head of the house, a woman it's heart. Bishop Williamson said that a man needs to be a straight pole in the ground so the woman the vine and wrap around him and grow upwards, yet so many don't want to submit to their husbands. So many 'trads' will deny scripture about a woman's duty to her husband, whether it be the marriage debt, obedience and other things. Even when you quote great Saints like St Thomas the trad feminists call you a sleezebag. Imagine if men called women names if they said that husband should love their wives like Christ loved the Church. I've seen on this forum a young lady saying she was felt a lot of pressure to get married, she was around ~22. Well it's not surprising, women do not age like men in terms of fertility, 22 is already late in my opinion so why does this girl and other feel this way? Is there no men up to their standards? Are they unwilling to marry an older man? Did their parents not properly raise them to be ready for marriage by ~18? It doesn't help that these girls do not explain why they feel this way so people can understand their perspective.
There is also boomer trads who think the economy is fine. People who just don't understand how younger men got shafted hard by diversity hiring and other Jєωιѕн garbage. "oh just pull yourself up by the bootstraps and work hard and stop complaining all the time". Men will come online to complain because in reality most men are POWERLESS. They have no real recourse to fix their situations. If a man is in his teens he can still manage if he works hard for 20+ years while living with his parents, just when his is ready for marriage with a house paid off and a career he will be in his 30s and his marriage options will be limited because brainwashing about age gaps mentioned previously. Now most guys are not working hard from their teens, usually it's in their 20s that most men will start to panic and realise that things are going the way they had hoped. For these men (and it's most men) they won't be able to marry (assuming they do things 'properly' from a Catholic courtship perspective) until they are in their late 30s and 40s. Yet most girls in their early to mid 20s don't want to marry these older men, even though it should be considered normal from a Catholic viewpoint.
This long article goes into the bullcrap white men have had to deal with since about 2014, men simply would not get hired because they were white, because they were a man, and because they weren't some ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ abomination.
https://www.compactmag.com/article/the-lost-generation/
Some will say these men should just do a trade job but not every man is cut out for a labor job, it's just how it is, likewise some tradesmen are not cut out for deskjobs.
In becoming a trad I had hoped that trads would be more disciplined that the average secular person and in most things they are. Most trads to not commit the same sins as secular people however there are certain things that disappoint me greatly that I did not expect. I've seen an incredible amount of trads who are overweight. it's really something. You would think mortification and fasting would keep trads slim and healthy, that they would know better since their body is temple for God and it should be keep pure body in body and soul. But no, I see obese, morbidly obese and beyond trads more than I do see slim and healthy trads. Trad wives with feminist style makeup (especially the lipstick urgh) whose daughters also wear this makeup (even 12yr old girls with heavy makeup :fryingpan:), girls who dress immodestly, whether it be tight clothing, clothes that are too short, clothes that are transparent, clothes with a slit on the legs, yet not a word from the pulpit about gluttony and immodesty in dress. Young ladies who mannerism leave much to be desired in terms of femininity, such as talking in a masculine manner, sitting with spread legs, being rude and disrespectful to men, listening to modern music :facepalm:. I have seen teenage girls with tattoos much to the dismay of the father (this indicates that the wife is the problem), teenage girls with nose piercing and lots of earrings, with fake dyed hair and having boyfriends and thinking it's okay to have relationships (I disagree, if it's not courtship it's not okay).
You have trad feminists online who claim to be Catholic/Christian yet they far from God because they deny His natural order between men and women. Some of these women think it's okay to date multiple men at the same time, and if you claim you will only marry a virgin they get very upset. I've had very pro EENS girls block me because I quoted the Dimonds here and there because apparently I am not extremely enough, must be pro EENS while also denouncing others for their personal faults :clown:.
I've had trads get upset at me for quoting Catholic theologians on healthy racism, because I am somehow a bad person because I don't want to race mix and destroy my bloondline and make my children struggle with all the issues that come with being mixed race :jester:. Because white people aren't allowed to have their own nations and their governments aren't allowed to put the native whites first over the non-white immigrants, even though the Catholic authority says otherwise.
I know I can only accept the tribulations that God sends me with patience and resignation. But am I so tired of all the hypocrisy from modern trads, they refuse recognise and obey the proper authority and order of authority that God has sent down. They have little charity when you aren't as extreme as them in certain positions. They don't acknowledge the differences between men and women or understand how much effort and time it requires to be a man capable of providing and leading a family, that when a man does achieve these things he must marry someone close to his age who may not even be able to give him children (I know trad couples with no children, I can't say why for certain but I would wager it's because the women wasn't young). I know a young man who married a fat women, and within months of being married she is now much larger than she was before. I know ladies who wear makeup and like secular music. I know priests who say a women shouldn't get married until 25 because of brain development and maturity.
Frankly I am tired and only getting older with each passing day, I do try to work hard and prepare myself so I can one day marry and raise Godly children, yet at every-turn I find opposition from those who are supposed to be my fellow brothers and sisters in Christ. I would have thought they would have some empathy and understanding to the struggle of the young instead it's usually a lecture and some propaganda about not being mature or working hard enough or not being man enough due to 'complaining' about these issues (or I could call it bringing up faults that need to be addressed and fixed). People who just don't seem to care. I don't want to ladies to grow old alone and miserable, I want them to marry young and be happy, even if that requires marrying an older man. I want the clergymen to actually accept Catholic dogma and have proper obedience to God and His Church, not picking and choosing because they don't care enough about the salvation of the faithful and would rather compromise with the enemy in Rome. I want the husbands to have Godly wives who are obedient to them in all things (bar sin), and wives to have loving husbands who don't abuse their authority. If I didn't care it would be much easier, but because I do care it's so much more difficult, seeing the state of things and frankly I do not believe that most trads will save their souls.
I do wish to love my (future) wife as Christ loved the Church, but I also expect obedience. I won't be compromising on Catholic doctrines, or my (basic) standards for women. I won't buckle under boomer delusion or Jєωιѕн propaganda. But realistically what can I do? Most of the women at my chapel are not ladies I would consider marrying, either because they aren't white, or they are fat, or they have tattoos, or took the covid injection, or they are not feminine or because they don't believe in EENS properly. My labor only pays me so much, or rather so little, in comparison to housing. By the time I am ready most of these girls will be too old for me to consider as I want to realistically have children and marrying an old women who may or may not give me children due to her lowered fertility is a risk factor I cannot ignore. The fact is these girls should already be looking for a husband while they are young, not waiting for 25 to hit before they even begin, and certainly not dismissing an older man simply because is old...
Now for those who will say that many people aren't called to the married life, just remember that the family unit is the most basic structure of society. If your sons and daughters cannot get married and have offspring for whatever reason, this is a SERIOUS problem that cannot be ignored. But from what I've seen most do not care, that's why this topic keep coming up over and over again on this forum and other website, because it's a foundational issue.
This post is not simply about women and feminists, not simply about the clergy and laypeople with inordinate obedience to God. It's the overall encompassing denial of reality that seems to be effecting trads. Trads who refuse to acknowledge that being a Catholic means being different from those who live in the world, so why do so many trads say the times have changed and want to deny how things were done in the past when it suits them? I could go on and on but I have already said enough.
This long article goes into the bullcrap white men have had to deal with since about 2014, men simply would not get hired because they were white, because they were a man, and because they weren't some ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ abomination.This is an interesting piece that has gone around lately, I found this excellent post on it today.
https://www.compactmag.com/article/the-lost-generation/ (https://www.compactmag.com/article/the-lost-generation/)
the thing about calling DEI 'economic genocide' is that it undersells it
yes, young White men were systematically excluded from careers during their peak marriage years, but that's just first-order effects.
second-order: marriage market collapse. women date across and up. men without careers become invisible to the women who would have married them and disappear. the "eligible bachelor" pool shrinks.
third-order: fertility crisis. fewer marriages, fewer children. but it's worse than just men not marrying or having families. the women who "won" the DEI lottery got careers instead of families, delayed fertility until it was too late. DEI attacked family formation from both sides, excluded men from provider roles AND diverted women from their fertility window. everyone lost.
fourth-order: psychological. young men couldn't even name what was happening to them. the same institutions that excluded them told them they were "privileged", that complaining was proof of weakness. so they internalized failure as personal inadequacy rather than systemic rigging, retreated into depression, video games, porn. the symptoms we then pathologized as "male failure". the system broke them (on purpose) and blamed them for being broken.
fifth-order: institutional trust gone. once you know positions are filled by demographics rather than competence, every credential becomes suspect (if not a priori worthless). is your doctor qualified or a diversity hire? your pilot? your engineer? you can't prove any individual is incompetent, but you can't trust any individual is competent either. medicine skepticism, academic failure, media skepticism, none of this emerged organically. it was manufactured by the DEI hire you can't be sure is qualified to treat you.
sixth-order: reality became unspeakable. noticing any of this was a fireable offense. pointing out the obvious got you called a bigot, deplatformed or fired. pure totalitarian censorship and the problem couldn't even be acknowledged (until now, finally)
men knew they were being cheated but couldn't say it. women sensed something was wrong with the men but couldn't identify it. relationships poisoned by a dynamic neither party could name.
seventh-order: the feedback loop. fewer eligible men means more women competing for a shrinking pool, more women losing the marriage market, more resentment, more "men are trash", more support for DEI, fewer eligible men and the system accelerates itself.
and the worst part is that DEI was just the economic arm. the same people and institutions pushed the complete package
"toxic masculinity" to pathologize male identity
"the future is female" as explicit zero-sum framing delusion
"believe all women" to weaponize trust against men
"men are trash" to normalize open contempt
a coordinated ideological assault on family formation.
and it even had a business model. HR departments exploded (millions of jobs invented to administer the regime). DEI consultants became a multi-billion dollar industry. politicians got voting blocs dependent on racial grievance. established boomers kept their positions while their competition was eliminated.
the architects knew what they were doing
you don't accidentally build a system that specifically targets men during peak marriage years, tells them they deserve it, makes it unspeakable to complain, attacks their identity as toxic, promotes women into career tracks that burn their fertility, then acts confused when society collapses
if you wanted to suppress the fertility of a specific demographic, engineer the breakdown of trust between the sexes, and make it illegal to notice, the playbook would look exactly like this.
DEI should be held responsible for the fertility crisis, the marriage collapse, the epidemic of male depression and ѕυιcιdє, the destruction of institutional trust, the atomization of society, and the manufactured war between men and women
but DEI was the weapon
the people who designed it, funded it, made it mandatory, enforced it through HR, fired anyone who resisted, called all opposition hate and racism, built careers and industries on its maintenance, they knew. and they're the ones who should be remembered as the architects of one of the worst crimes against humanity
This is an interesting piece that has gone around lately, I found this excellent post on it today.Not sure why the text is the wrong color...
https://x.com/IterIntellectus/status/2000846259645514219
the thing about calling DEI 'economic genocide' is that it undersells it
yes, young White men were systematically excluded from careers during their peak marriage years, but that's just first-order effects.
second-order: marriage market collapse. women date across and up. men without careers become invisible to the women who would have married them and disappear. the "eligible bachelor" pool shrinks.
third-order: fertility crisis. fewer marriages, fewer children. but it's worse than just men not marrying or having families. the women who "won" the DEI lottery got careers instead of families, delayed fertility until it was too late. DEI attacked family formation from both sides, excluded men from provider roles AND diverted women from their fertility window. everyone lost.
fourth-order: psychological. young men couldn't even name what was happening to them. the same institutions that excluded them told them they were "privileged", that complaining was proof of weakness. so they internalized failure as personal inadequacy rather than systemic rigging, retreated into depression, video games, porn. the symptoms we then pathologized as "male failure". the system broke them (on purpose) and blamed them for being broken.
fifth-order: institutional trust gone. once you know positions are filled by demographics rather than competence, every credential becomes suspect (if not a priori worthless). is your doctor qualified or a diversity hire? your pilot? your engineer? you can't prove any individual is incompetent, but you can't trust any individual is competent either. medicine skepticism, academic failure, media skepticism, none of this emerged organically. it was manufactured by the DEI hire you can't be sure is qualified to treat you.
sixth-order: reality became unspeakable. noticing any of this was a fireable offense. pointing out the obvious got you called a bigot, deplatformed or fired. pure totalitarian censorship and the problem couldn't even be acknowledged (until now, finally)
men knew they were being cheated but couldn't say it. women sensed something was wrong with the men but couldn't identify it. relationships poisoned by a dynamic neither party could name.
seventh-order: the feedback loop. fewer eligible men means more women competing for a shrinking pool, more women losing the marriage market, more resentment, more "men are trash", more support for DEI, fewer eligible men and the system accelerates itself.
and the worst part is that DEI was just the economic arm. the same people and institutions pushed the complete package
"toxic masculinity" to pathologize male identity
"the future is female" as explicit zero-sum framing delusion
"believe all women" to weaponize trust against men
"men are trash" to normalize open contempt
a coordinated ideological assault on family formation.
and it even had a business model. HR departments exploded (millions of jobs invented to administer the regime). DEI consultants became a multi-billion dollar industry. politicians got voting blocs dependent on racial grievance. established boomers kept their positions while their competition was eliminated.
the architects knew what they were doing
you don't accidentally build a system that specifically targets men during peak marriage years, tells them they deserve it, makes it unspeakable to complain, attacks their identity as toxic, promotes women into career tracks that burn their fertility, then acts confused when society collapses
if you wanted to suppress the fertility of a specific demographic, engineer the breakdown of trust between the sexes, and make it illegal to notice, the playbook would look exactly like this.
DEI should be held responsible for the fertility crisis, the marriage collapse, the epidemic of male depression and ѕυιcιdє, the destruction of institutional trust, the atomization of society, and the manufactured war between men and women
but DEI was the weapon
the people who designed it, funded it, made it mandatory, enforced it through HR, fired anyone who resisted, called all opposition hate and racism, built careers and industries on its maintenance, they knew. and they're the ones who should be remembered as the architects of one of the worst crimes against humanity
When I first became a traditional Catholic I had assumed that traditional Catholics would be strong and zealous to obey God and keep traditional Catholic teaching.
Frankly I am tired and only getting older with each passing day, I do try to work hard and prepare myself so I can one day marry and raise Godly children, yet at every-turn I find opposition from those who are supposed to be my fellow brothers and sisters in Christ.
This post is not simply about women and feminists, not simply about the clergy and laypeople with inordinate obedience to God. It's the overall encompassing denial of reality that seems to be effecting trads. Trads who refuse to acknowledge that being a Catholic means being different from those who live in the world, so why do so many trads say the times have changed and want to deny how things were done in the past when it suits them? I could go on and on but I have already said enough.
Why don't you expanded on how OP can quit wasting their life? They already are Catholic and work, what more do you expect them to do?☝🏻 yes this right here reflects the heart of Jesus and the saints. This is the suffering servant that loves his enemies, heals the sick, feeds the poor, visits the prisoners, clothes the naked, 👍🏻☝🏻 this guy right here gets it! He’s got a heart like a dog. 🐕 a vicious dog! I will give you guys credit the mentors and leadership with a
Why do you make retarded boomer liberal arguements? "Oh some nigger in africa is poorer than you so you can't be upset for being poor"
Why are you boomer like this?
Now that you articulated all your complaints about lukewarm trads, what are you going to do about?
Get off-line, stop complaining, and do something to fix the problems you see within your abilities, however small it is, start setting the example you wish other Trads could be.
The previous comment was mine.Great point.
Converts to traditional catholicism arrive at their faith because they are thinkers. But thinking is a minority sport, always has been.
We must be like salmon swimming upriver, even amongst our own. To expect that things could be otherwise is an illusion.
That response is not the best example of brotherly love.
.... Not for retarded remarks like yours. Not for critical feminists. Just a bit of brotherly love. That's it.
People, when someone posts like this, and you can't say something helpful. THEN SHUT YOUR MOUTH AND SAY NOTHING INSTEAD. Got it?
or the sedes with their contradictory denial that V2 is a false council that taught error/heresy while believing and quoting the very docuмent that V2 used to deny EENS
and 'Pope' Sanborn with his nonsense authority with una cuм and denial of sacraments for those who believe in baptism and EENS
Why would you denigrate a bishop for? He never considered himself pope.
That response is not the best example of brotherly love.
31 Be not solicitous therefore, saying, What shall we eat: or what shall we drink, or wherewith shall we be clothed [or whom thou shouldst marry]? 32 For after all these things do the heathens seek. For your Father knoweth that you have need of all these things. 33 Seek ye therefore first the kingdom of God, and his justice, and all these things shall be added unto you.
Your 2 last posts in this thread were very edifying to read. Thankyou, Ladislaus.Thanks, Ladislaus! I second Jen’s post.
Oh, no need to thank me. I just think it's very important not to judge people, and I think passing judgments on people as being "fake" and "lukewarm" has contributed to OP's consternation. If you go in with the attitude of "everyone here is better than I am", then you will not be distrubed or upset or tired of other people as much as you will be upset with yourself.Thank you for this very interesting and helpful comment. A priest said to me love the sinner hate the sin. I’ll read your comment again when I’ve more time. Thank you for taking the time to post all this. I think you’re right about the difference between how modern Catholics and trads approach others. We don’t know the suffering someone has been through to cause their actions.
Now, the Conciliars go to the opposite extreme where they say you can't judge actions, and you basically have to say because "Who am I to judge?" this means I cannot judge that sodomy is a grave sin? No, you can and you must.
BUT ... while judging sodomy to be a grave sin, it's very important to not judge the internal forum of the one committing these sins, meaning, the degree of culpability before God. I think that people mistake this also for how we can't judge people's motives. Well, sometimes we actually can, and very often they leak out into the external forum.
What it means that we cannot judge the internal forum is illustrated by what I wrote above where ... just imagine you were born in the same family, the same circuмstances, the same genes, the same temperament, had all the exact same experiences, and received and did not receive the same graces ... would you actually have done better? They've done stories on identical twins separated at birth where they end up having lived almost identical lives, where they ended up in the same jobs, picked spouses who were incredibly similar, not only in personality but even in looks, etc. ... just remarkable similarities.
Nor does this mean you have to like everyone. I might not like how they think, what they talk about, maybe it doesn't suit me, or as with OP, this doesn't mean he must find everyone he meets attractive and/or that he's required to give them equals consideration as prospective spouses.
And that's where I think the extremes are on both sides .... where the Conciliars go to the extreme in refusing to judge objective right and wrong, where people on either side (Conciliar or Traditional) feel guilty as if they commit sins against charity simply because they don't like some people, don't see eye to eye with them, don't want to be friends, but then on the other side where people overreact to the Conciliar error on "do not judge" by getting incredibly harsh with people who have fallen into sin, doing things like calling sodomites "dirty fαɢs".
While Bergoglio confirms them in their sin, where charity requires that we rebuke them, those Prots that carry around signs like "God hates fαɢs" (that one particular group), that just doesn't draw the ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖs toward Christianity or conversion, and those would have been the ones to cast the first stones at Mary Magdalene.
Our Lord shows the perfect balance. He does not condone the sin, but calls it out, tells the sinner to sin no more ... but then He shows such great Mercy that a Mary Magdalen became converted to one of the greatest saints due to the love that was born from gratitude for His Mercy.
Conciliars give various predators slaps on the wrist and allow ... and practically encourage ... them to reoffend, etc. But then Traditional Catholics overreact in the opposite direction by often being extremely cruel, sometimes vicious ... in judging their internal forum. I actually feel sorry for the perpetrator as well. I feel sorry for even for serial killers, and even Satanists. Yes, they're objectively evil, but you can read the stories of some of these people, who they were perhaps abused as children, sometimes sɛҳuąƖly, where they were exposed to evil, like pornography, at a very young age, where they were mistreated, and then developed cruel streaks, where maybe they had a psychological problem and started by torturing an animal, and then stepped up from there ... with very little exposure to the faith. I see these stories, say of a serial killer, where maybe he assaulted and murdered 100 people, and then realize that, were it not for the grace of God, if I had been in his shoes, I could easily have killed 200. As far as even Satanists, just take the case of a Bartolo Longo.
We are nothing except by the sheer mercy and grace of God.
Sometimes you have to be a bit harder, of course ... such as when the Lord denounced the Pharisees as a brood of vipers, painted sepulchers, ets. Why? Even that was out of charity, since He knew that they were beyond where kind words would turn them around AND He had to make it clear to everyone else to avoid such attitudes like the plague, where that kind of stubborn pride is actually worse than sins of weakness, which He was always very compassionate towards, admitting that while the spirit may be willing, the flesh is weak. But the proud and arrogant are the most impervious to converting, since conversion requires humility ... and those who sin by weakness are invariably humbled by those falls.
And this is actually where the Church has been strong and forceful ... in condemning bad ideas and bad doctrine. Bishop Williamson often spoke about this how there's this modern notion that being "nithe" and "chawitable" means that we cannot reject and condemn bad ideas, errors, bad doctrine. That is completely false. In fact, in this day and age, it's all the more imperative to CONDEMN THEM IN THE STRONGEST TERMS.
If you FAIL to do so, then what you're doing is effectively giving the impression that it's OK, that's it's perfectly fine fo a Catholic to hold certain ideas, and that it's contrary to charity, and it's proud to condemn someone's ideas. So, for instance, I will not hesitate for one second to call a spade a spade and I openly call out Father Paul Robinson for Modernist Heresy. People will say, but "that's not nice" and "it's disrespectful". So ... if a child is about to eat a spoonful of sugar that you know has been laced with poison, are you going to say something mealy-mouthed like "well, I'm not so sure about that sugar ... may not be all that good for you", or are you going to shout poison and slap the spoon out of the child's hand. You do the former since you don't wish to hurt the child's feelings, or cause some distress, or worry ... but you do that latter to save the child's life. Similarly with heresy, if I just mealy-mouthed it on what I now to be heresy, saying, "Well, Father Robinson, I respectfully disagree with your point of view." Absolutely not. That is not going to get anyone thinking, neither him, nor anyone who might be reading what he wrote and sucking it up because, well, a Traditional priest who uses lots of nice-smelling inense and chants Latin said it. This makes it even that much more necessary to be very direct, and very blunt. If I unhestitatingly calle it what it is, MODERNIST HERESY, at the very least it'll have the shock value of getting him to think about it a bit, and also send out a warning to those who might otherwise be deceived by it, or even if they don't buy it entirely, have their own faith weakened by thinking it's within the range of "acceptable". If you even consider a heresy acceptable or tenable, then it's corrupting your sense of the faith just to hold that. It's like when +Fellay walked into Rome holding a cruxifix and people claiming he was witnessing to the truth. Was he? Or was he saying that "hey, these LGBTQ+ guys that are right behind us on the itinerary next week ... yeah, we belong to the same religion, and the same Church", and thereby corrupting the truth? When Wojtyla stood on stage at Assisi with his cruxifix, next to the Buddhist, was he witnessing to the faith ... or denying it, by promoting the idea that, yeah, these guys here, they're OK too, and we're really all on the same team?
That was why the "Dubia" from those Conciliar Cardinals was actually very harmful. So, when faced with blatant heresy like in Amoris Laetitia ... there's no doubt whatsoever that it's heretical, if you couch your concerns as "doubts" and "uncertainties" and confront them in such a mealy-mouthed fashion, then you're saying that ... holding such an opinion does not make you non-Catholic, i.e. that one can be a Catholic and hold the opinion taught there. Rather than testifying tot he truth with that, they actually undermined it. And, one is a heretic not only for rejecting Church dogma, but also for doubting it. So when you claim that you are not certain that a heresy is heretical, then this means that you're not certain about the dogma it contradicts, and therefore doubt it also. So the "Dubia" was actually giving testimony to the acceptability of the heresy, and then they did nothing about it. These "Dubia" Cardinals were required before God to ACCUSE BERGOGLIO OF HERESY berfore God and before the Church, as witness to the truth. At that point, perhaps even Bergoglio would get the message and ... maybe repent if there's any good will left? ... or at the very least you would be in fact witnessing to the truth. That's one of their chief jobs as bishops and cardinals, mentioned in the Rite of Consecration ... to uphold the truth. But they are failing in that by not emphatically calling heresy heresy. Perhaps St. John the Baptist should have said about Herod, "well, we should investigate the status of your marriage and make a determination about whether or not you're really committing adultery in the internal forum".
Anyway ... long digression, but these are important things to think about.
Thank you for this very interesting and helpful comment. A priest said to me love the sinner hate the sin. I’ll read your comment again when I’ve more time. Thank you for taking the time to post all this. I think you’re right about the difference between how modern Catholics and trads approach others. We don’t know the suffering someone has been through to cause their actions.
I am not the OP.
I am the other guy commenting.
Laddy and Jen. Saying "mind your own business" is a distraction.
He's judging mostly of what COMES OUT OF PEOPLE'S MOUTHS.
So when people say things which excuse bad behavior, that IS objectively scandalous.
So I revert to what I said earlier.
IF YOU CANNOT SAY SOMETHING HELPFUL, SHUT YOUR MOUTH.
I am not the OP.
I am the other guy commenting.
Laddy and Jen. Saying "mind your own business" is a distraction.
He's judging mostly of what COMES OUT OF PEOPLE'S MOUTHS.
So when people say things which excuse bad behavior, that IS objectively scandalous.
So I revert to what I said earlier.
IF YOU CANNOT SAY SOMETHING HELPFUL, SHUT YOUR MOUTH.
But the hostility in this post suggests that the comments we made struck a nerve, so you need to examine your own conscience for judgmental and Pharisaical attitudes ... since Our Lord expressed far more indignation about those than he did about any sins of weakness, such as a weakness for eating too much pie or candy bars. Someone with such a weakness offends God FAR LESS, and could even please God if it humbles them ... whereas the types who "thank God they are not like these others", those are the ones who are not justified and forgiven before God.This.
This.
But then on the flip side, the "Pharisacical attitudes" card is often played to defend oneself from warranted (and sometimes necessary) criticism (hopefully to the effect of correcting the sinner/error). It is a constant balancing act - knowing when to speak and when to remain silent. Imagine John the Baptist just shuffling his feet staring the ground and saying "don't judge" instead of marching up to Herod and telling him, "It is not lawful for you to take your brothers wife." :facepalm: What I have noticed most of all over the YEARS of reading on this forum is the abject snowflakery of 99% of trads - no spine, no humility, just the pretense of "wisdom". I think a good portion of this thread shows that.
Seems like it was your nerve that was struck.
Imagine being such a retard that you think that love is about being sweet all the time.
Did I offend you princess with my harsh language? Maybe it struck a nerve?
Seems like it was your nerve that was struck.
I am not the OP.
I am the other guy commenting.
Laddy and Jen. Saying "mind your own business" is a distraction.
He's judging mostly of what COMES OUT OF PEOPLE'S MOUTHS.
So when people say things which excuse bad behavior, that IS objectively scandalous.
So I revert to what I said earlier.
IF YOU CANNOT SAY SOMETHING HELPFUL, SHUT YOUR MOUTH.
I wouldn't say it's denigration, and he put the word "Pope" in quotes ... and this is a problem with many Trad groups, this being a reference to where they will impose various positions or opinions on the consciences of others, something which they don't have the authority to do. Bishop Sanborn does it on some points, SSPV are the most far-reaching with refusing Sacraments if you don't agree with them, and others like CMRI and SSPX being the least imposing. While the latter groups have strong opinions on various issues, I've not known them to refuse the Sacraments to people who disagree.
"Yeah bro you are fine you're not starving to death."I'm neither a troll nor an agent.
"You have basic literacy not like some nigger in africa"
"Are you grateful"
"Instead of addressing the problems with trads I will just say you are wallowing in self-pity"
"I do feel compassion for you but you are a disgusting brat who needs to grow up
"Just use the internet bro and get professional (Jєωιѕн) help)"
"You might be a troll or agent"
From your contradictory post I would say that you are the troll or agent.
Can someone name a person who is a great traditional Catholic? I think we are all tired of the Crisis.I can think of 3; Me, Myself, & I :cowboy:
Yes, it is definitively denigration. He doesn't claim to be pope, he doesn't do anything a pope does. He doesn't claim ordinary jurisdiction. People just denigrate him because they don't like some decisions he has made. Mistaken conclusions don't warrant denigration. The mature Catholic will say he is mistaken, and show why.Alternatively, trad clerics (+Sanborn included) should not refuse the Sacraments to those faithful who do not submit to their opinions
Sorry that’s me! This anonymous stuff is nonsense. ☝🏻Yes, it is. And Mr. Anonymous OP down-voted you for pointing it out.
Yes, it is definitively denigration. He doesn't claim to be pope, he doesn't do anything a pope does. He doesn't claim ordinary jurisdiction. People just denigrate him because they don't like some decisions he has made. Mistaken conclusions don't warrant denigration. The mature Catholic will say he is mistaken, and show why.He may not claim it but by Binding people by pain of sin to certain opinions of his he acts like it.
Lad,I'm op and lads comment was helpful. I'm not sure why you are being so rude.
I'm not even bothering to read your ridiculous long posts.
Get a life bro. Get off the computer. Or at least go do real work.
You're clearly some kind of autist.
You have perfected the retarded art of not getting the point.
We get it, you're autistic and care about no one but yourself.
Maybe go make talk to your wife more or something. I dunno, or get real life friends.
I'm neither a troll nor an agent.You told op to go to therapy....
Your attempted straw-manning is sub par even for the internet.
Since when is compassion separated from truth telling?
The OP sounds lonely. He may think finding the right woman will solve his problem, which it will not. He needs men friends. No woman is going to trust a man who does not have friends who are men. Hanging around with other men may help him adjust so he does not appear whiny to others.Bad advice.
Bad advice.Why is this bad advice?
Alternatively, trad clerics (+Sanborn included) should not refuse the Sacraments to those faithful who do not submit to their opinions
Priests have a conscience and have to handle things the best way they know how. Study the issue, perhaps you will agree with whatever it is. If not, life is tough, comply if you want the Sacraments. Offer it up. Consider it a penance. It's worth it.lol "Just comply bro"
Priests have a conscience and have to handle things the best way they know how. Study the issue, perhaps you will agree with whatever it is. If not, life is tough, comply if you want the Sacraments. Offer it up. Consider it a penance. It's worth it.
Unless some opinion of theirs has been defined by the Church, they are not permitted to withhold the Sacraments from the faithful who ask for them. Given their lack of jurisdiction, and their role as emergency dispensers of the Sacraments, it's only the faithful requesting the Sacraments that permit them to do so at all, so they're not in any position to deny them except in the case of something obvious that's clearly defined by the Church, and not just something they decided is certain due to their own reasoning.
They may opine on the matter, but that's it. "I believe that +Thuc-line bishops and priests are not valid. If you go there, you're putting your soul in grave danger. Here's the reasoning behind why I think that." If they layman says, "thanks for the advice, but I don't agee" and they ask for the Sacraments, then the priest must provide them. Bishops have no more authority than priests, but are there as emergency dispensers of the Sacraments that priests cannot provid ... Holy Orders and confirmation. I wish the Traditonal bishops would stop carrying around their croziers and sitting on thrones. They need to drop that and use a faldstool during Mass.
Yes, it is definitively denigration. He doesn't claim to be pope, he doesn't do anything a pope does. He doesn't claim ordinary jurisdiction. People just denigrate him because they don't like some decisions he has made. Mistaken conclusions don't warrant denigration. The mature Catholic will say he is mistaken, and show why.
I'm op and lads comment was helpful. I'm not sure why you are being so rude.
Anon #1 and Anon #2 want to complain about their circuмstances and feel justified in their indignation, not take good spiritual advice from older more seasoned men.https://x.com/mattforney/status/2001359957187293680
That’s the jist of it. They will only entertain those that agree with them.
This is directionally correct but ignores the very real hatred and contempt boomer men have for their sons and their sick fascination with bending over backwards for their daughters.
All boomers regardless of political belief are simps. They will do anything for their daughters, bail them out of any bad situation, while leaving their sons to twist in the wind. A while back, a guy posted on here about how he justifiably felt a little resentment when he offered to buy his dad's car off him and was told no only for the dad to outright give it to the guy's sister when she could afford to buy her own car. Every millennial guy and tons of zoomers, the ones with sisters, have stories of our parents screwing us over like this to some degree. Some creep replied to OP to the effect of "your dad was right to screw you over, and in fact, I'm going to personally pay my daughter's rent so she doesn't have to marry some dirtbag for money" (what is this, 1750?). I'm convinced that if infanticide were legal, a significant number of boomers would have left their infant sons exposed on a hilltop.
Boomers have a bizarre two-tier mentality where their sons are expected to scrape and fight for everything with no help whatsoever, a cartoonish interpretation of trad masculinity, while they encourage their daughters to be progressive, aim for the stars, and give them everything they can to help. DEI played perfectly on the boomer's character defects because it allowed them justification for something they'd already been doing.
Another example: I once worked at a tech startup run by a boomer. He hired a Filipina administrative assistant and treated her like a daughter, at one point buying her a Mercedes on the company dime. She totaled it a week later because she was that bad of an alcoholic. She was also later discovered to have embezzled a quarter of a million from the company.
The recent trend of Zillow crack shack slop posting is the final degeneration of the boomer's obsession with protecting his daughters and eating his sons. "Man up" style shaming language is used to browbeat young white men into accepting third class status. "Lower your expectations, white man. Move to Shitstain, Iowa, work at Hy-Vee, and live in a former meth lab. You don't deserve to have dreams or ambitions. OTHER people get to be doctors, lawyers, tech workers, or politicians, but not you. You're a pussy if you don't choose to immiserate yourself." The boomer would never dare give that advice to his daughter. He's probably paying her law school tuition. He almost certainly put her on birth control when she was 16 because he didn't have the balls to tell her not to be a slut (while telling his son he would kill him if he got anyone pregnant at that age).
Why are boomers like this? Is it because they're afraid of their wives (boomer women are borderline feral)? Is it because they want to fuck their daughters? Is it because they view their sons as sɛҳuąƖ competition? Either way, we see the effects of it all around us.
DEI was able to destroy the lives of white male millennials and zoomers because it played to the boomer's cucked, servile, wounded ego. If boomer men didn't have an incestuous obsession with their daughters, none of this pressure from women and minorities would have worked.
You told op to go to therapy.......and? Is therapy, or thinking that someone might possibly benefit from it, sinful now?
Some time back it was recommended that you seek professional help. I can't say that that advice was wrong. Hard as it may be to admit, your biggest problems might be yours, and not due to everyone and everything outside yourself.
...and? Is therapy, or thinking that someone might possibly benefit from it, sinful now?Professional help = therapy
To be precise, though, I did not NOT tell you to go to therapy, I deliberately said this:
...and? Is therapy, or thinking that someone might possibly benefit from it, sinful now?The problem with your advice is that it doesn't touch the issue. Ops problem is with other people yet you ignore that and act like a Boomer. Because your advice is missing the mark completely, it's as if you didn't even consider what op wrote, because if you did you wouldnt have given generic platitudes.
To be precise, though, I did not NOT tell you to go to therapy, I deliberately said this:
If I were Croix, I would say that you need your ass kicked. And there's truth to that, I'm sure that it would be of some help. But it would likely only result in an external change. As long as someone is around, you'd act better, but as soon as the pressure was off it'd be back to the same silliness.
I'm convinced that there is an aspect of maturing that is of free choice. One has to consciously decide to grow up, to be willing to do the necessary work. But you have to do it ONLY because you want to. You shouldn't do it for me or for anyone else here, or for your family, or (you'll probably consider it highly impious of me to say) even for God Himself. You should do it for YOU.
So, as far as therapy goes, I have not and would not absolutely tell you to go. Anyways, unless you want it, want to see if it's a tool that might be helpful, and are willing to put in the work, it wouldn't do any good.
An additional point about external factors that I think deserving of consideration. Immaturity, or delayed maturity, is becoming a more and more common problem in the world, especially the West.
1) Technology and social programs have taken much of the physical danger out of life. The effects of an action, or inaction, are no longer so immediate. So people don't learn simple lessons and skills that should be, and were once considered, common sense.
2) Lack of fathers in the home. People do sometimes need a kick in the butt. Dad is usually the one best equipped to give it.
I give these as reasons to help explain a phenomenon, NOT to be used to further a shitty, excuse seeking, paralyzing attitude. When you have a need that isn't being met, obey our Lord's directive, "Seek and you shall find".
Technology causing you problems? Shut it off or at least figure out a way to use it as a help rather than a hindrance to your advancement.
No dad around to kick you in the butt? Then you better learn to kick it yourself.
You fail, fall back into old habits? Get up, try to figure out what went wrong, make changes and try again. And again. And again. And again...... as many times as necessary.
You want to dismiss this as a bunch out of touch boomer platitudes? Go right ahead. No one owes you guys a damn thing and I'm guilt-trip proof. When you get old enough, you'll realize that the only person you've really been hurting with your crap is yourself, and it's your own fault. :laugh1: :jester: :laugh2:
Now I'm off to do fun boomer things. See Ya!
...and? Is therapy, or thinking that someone might possibly benefit from it, sinful now?The myth that struggle or suffering builds character is another boomerism that needs to die. Nine times out of ten, suffering just makes people worse because it gives them an excuse to wound collect and behave like shitheads. "I was raped as a kid, that's why I'm an asshole!"
To be precise, though, I did not NOT tell you to go to therapy, I deliberately said this:
If I were Croix, I would say that you need your ass kicked. And there's truth to that, I'm sure that it would be of some help. But it would likely only result in an external change. As long as someone is around, you'd act better, but as soon as the pressure was off it'd be back to the same silliness.
I'm convinced that there is an aspect of maturing that is of free choice. One has to consciously decide to grow up, to be willing to do the necessary work. But you have to do it ONLY because you want to. You shouldn't do it for me or for anyone else here, or for your family, or (you'll probably consider it highly impious of me to say) even for God Himself. You should do it for YOU.
So, as far as therapy goes, I have not and would not absolutely tell you to go. Anyways, unless you want it, want to see if it's a tool that might be helpful, and are willing to put in the work, it wouldn't do any good.
An additional point about external factors that I think deserving of consideration. Immaturity, or delayed maturity, is becoming a more and more common problem in the world, especially the West.
1) Technology and social programs have taken much of the physical danger out of life. The effects of an action, or inaction, are no longer so immediate. So people don't learn simple lessons and skills that should be, and were once considered, common sense.
2) Lack of fathers in the home. People do sometimes need a kick in the butt. Dad is usually the one best equipped to give it.
I give these as reasons to help explain a phenomenon, NOT to be used to further a shitty, excuse seeking, paralyzing attitude. When you have a need that isn't being met, obey our Lord's directive, "Seek and you shall find".
Technology causing you problems? Shut it off or at least figure out a way to use it as a help rather than a hindrance to your advancement.
No dad around to kick you in the butt? Then you better learn to kick it yourself.
You fail, fall back into old habits? Get up, try to figure out what went wrong, make changes and try again. And again. And again. And again...... as many times as necessary.
You want to dismiss this as a bunch out of touch boomer platitudes? Go right ahead. No one owes you guys a damn thing and I'm guilt-trip proof. When you get old enough, you'll realize that the only person you've really been hurting with your crap is yourself, and it's your own fault. :laugh1: :jester: :laugh2:
Now I'm off to do fun boomer things. See Ya!
The myth that struggle or suffering builds character is another boomerism that needs to die. Nine times out of ten, suffering just makes people worse because it gives them an excuse to wound collect and behave like shitheads. "I was raped as a kid, that's why I'm an asshole!"This is partially true. If someone doesn't carry their cross then their sufferings won't benefit them, for most secular people it is so.
Why is this bad advice?Male friends does not cure male loneliness. It's very difficult to have a close male friend unless you are young. Also it makes no sense to think a woman would care if a man has male friends or not.
Right, and I talked about it too. As with almost everything, as St. Augustine said virtus in medio stat, that virtue (usually) lies in the middle. We have the Bergoglio distortion of "Who am I to judge?" ... which is that there is no objective right or wrong, that it's all relative. But then the opposite extreme is judging the individual's internal forum, considering him "scuм". That latter manifests itself more in one's attitude. If you see a sodomite and you're thinking "what a filthy scuм", you're that's a warning sign that you're slipping into the latter territory. Yes, what he's DOING may undoubtedly be filthy and scuмmy, but we always have to keep in mind the St. Augustine saying of "there but for the grace of God go I". Would I be less scuмmy if I had been in his shoes? Probably not. Then of course, there's a different level of opposition where you oppose the MILITANT types, i.e. those who promote the liceity of their behavior in principle, vs. those are just sinners.Ok but I can see externally that a fat person is far, tattoos are external things too. I might not know why a woman has a tattoos but I do know they indicate mental illness/family trouble. I do know that you cannot get fat without eating excessive amounts of calories. I would expect more also from people who are supposed to be TRADITIONAL. I would think that if a child is fat either the parents are ignorant of basic nutrient/macro/calorie information or they know this info but are still not feeding their kids correctly. There are things that can be deduced, even if I do not know the internal forum.
So, absolutely, it's a very difficult balance to maintain, since at times it's very difficult to distinguish and to extricate the sin from the sinner, the depravity of the actual behavior from a judgment of the internal forum.
Also, internal forum isn't just a person's "intention", since even the intention can be obvious just from the external forum. Someone commits adultery or sodomy. Intention is very clear ... personal grafitification of the emotional and/or physical variety. That notion of "intention" is often conflated with that properly "internal forum" consideration that's in the inner sanctum of the soul, at the very deepest layer of free will that we ourselves often cannot discern and only God knows and can objectively judge.
That's actually the absurdity of Bergoglio's Amoris Laetitia, here he says you can discern your own internal forum to decide whether adultery is wrong. AT BEST you MIGHT be able to do some discernment about the degree of sinfulness regarding some of yoru PAST actions, where maybe you truly were ignorant or something. Even then, God might judge that your ignorance was culpable since there was a leve at which you didn't really want to know and therefore did not try too hard to find out. At that level, we ourselves do not generally know, and only God does and will reveal it to us at our particular judgment. But that Bergoglio said that people could work with their confessors to internal-forum discern whether they could CONTINUE in the current objectively-sinful activity, it's ridiculous. At this point, if you're even "discerning", it's clear than that you KNOW by now that it's objectively sinful. What they're really claiming is ... you're deciding whether objective rules of morality apply in your own situation because "it's just too hard" or "it's OK since I really love this person". They're using it to bend the objective rules of morality and not actually to assess their degree of culpability.
The myth that struggle or suffering builds character is another boomerism that needs to die. Nine times out of ten, suffering just makes people worse because it gives them an excuse to wound collect and behave like shitheads. "I was raped as a kid, that's why I'm an asshole!"I think it depends on how you respond to the suffering you’ve endured. Some people develop victim mentality, others learn and grow. I don’t think we can judge people unless we know their history. There are people I know who, if I’d had their childhoods I’d probably now be in prison.
I think it depends on how you respond to the suffering you’ve endured. Some people develop victim mentality, others learn and grow.Parents are a big factor in this. I've had very hard times, where I though: "Why aren't my parents helping me?"
The problem with your advice is that it doesn't touch the issue. Ops problem is with other people yet you ignore that and act like a Boomer. Because your advice is missing the mark completely, it's as if you didn't even consider what op wrote, because if you did you wouldnt have given generic platitudes.Op doesn't seem to be doing "what he can", though. Op seems to want to make everything external to himself; all his problems are from other people. His Faith also seems to consist mainly of externals too; other Catholics should do x, y, & z or I can't be at peace.
Op already said he's doing what he can, other that lads advice do you have anything that i actually useful to say to him?
Unless some opinion of theirs has been defined by the Church, they are not permitted to withhold the Sacraments from the faithful who ask for them. Given their lack of jurisdiction, and their role as emergency dispensers of the Sacraments, it's only the faithful requesting the Sacraments that permit them to do so at all, so they're not in any position to deny them except in the case of something obvious that's clearly defined by the Church, and not just something they decided is certain due to their own reasoning.
They may opine on the matter, but that's it. "I believe that +Thuc-line bishops and priests are not valid. If you go there, you're putting your soul in grave danger. Here's the reasoning behind why I think that." If they layman says, "thanks for the advice, but I don't agee" and they ask for the Sacraments, then the priest must provide them. Bishops have no more authority than priests, but are there as emergency dispensers of the Sacraments that priests cannot provid ... Holy Orders and confirmation. I wish the Traditonal bishops would stop carrying around their croziers and sitting on thrones. They need to drop that and use a faldstool during Mass.
Op doesn't seem to be doing "what he can", though. Op seems to want to make everything external to himself; all his problems are from other people. His Faith also seems to consist mainly of externals too; other Catholics should do x, y, & z or I can't be at peace.
It's one of the primary lessons to be taken from the story of Adam and Eve. Even though their external situation was perfect, they still screwed it up. And every single one of us would do the same. If you put me in the Garden, I would've fallen, so would you. If you had all the things that you complain about; a perfect upbringing, surrounded by perfect people, a perfect society, had a 12 year old, white, submissive, virgin slave girl, etc., you'd still mess it up and find something to complain about. If I had all the things that I think would make my life perfect, I'd screw it up too. It can be hard to face, but it is true and the truth really does set a person free. Our main problem is internal, it's ourselves.
The same with the Faith. It seems at times that trads fall into the same basic errors as the Pharisees; degrade the Faith into a list of rules and external practices and give little heed to the inward man. The sad truth is that even if everything was restored in the Church, the way we talk about so often here, we'd still screw it up and find something to complain about. I often wonder now if that isn't maybe why the present situation exists; so that we may have a chance to see.
Neither shall they say: Behold here, or behold there. For lo, the kingdom of God is within you.
[Luke 17:21]
They are making a conclusion about sin. This is what they are required to do. Priests make rules about approaching the communion rail. Those policies aren't looked at as mere opinion that they shouldn't be making. Every accepts those rules even when they differ among priests.The Church makes the rules, not priests.
Anon #1 and Anon #2 want to complain about their circuмstances and feel justified in their indignation, not take good spiritual advice from older more seasoned men.
That’s the jist of it. They will only entertain those that agree with them.
I'm op and lads comment was helpful. I'm not sure why you are being so rude.
Yeah, unfortunately, there's something that got under his skin, undoubtedly calling out a lack of charity in judging the internal forum, and for pointing how it is that the saints were able to consider themselves the greatest of sinners, i.e. how they sincerely believed it to be true.
Every since then he's been lashing out ... perhaps something goaded his conscience. When that happens, there's usually a decision point, where you either double down or you start to think whether or not some adjustment might be needed.
His tone reminds me an awful lot of when Our Lord accused the Pharisees, and they responded with increased hatred.
The myth that struggle or suffering builds character is another boomerism that needs to die. Nine times out of ten, suffering just makes people worse because it gives them an excuse to wound collect and behave like shitheads. "I was raped as a kid, that's why I'm an asshole!"
You fell for the Marxist pitting younger generations against older ones. Yes, you have.Boomer literally had life on easy mode compared to their parents and children. A boomer could succeed a lot more with a small amount of suffering.
Boomers say that suffering and struggle builds character BECAUSE they knew how. It doesn't do so unless you know how to work with. People over 60 knew how.
Boomer literally had life on easy mode compared to their parents and children. A boomer could succeed a lot more with a small amount of suffering.
They should be praised, not denigrated. They knew how to use struggle to their advantage.Is it praise worthy to live in a time of abundance and succeed? Most boomers are morally decrepit. Worldly success aside they are not virtuous people.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Z3RcXlNaMwAlso a possibility:
They should be praised, not denigrated. They knew how to use struggle to their advantage.
Is it praise worthy to live in a time of abundance and succeed? Most boomers are morally decrepit. Worldly success aside they are not virtuous people.
While we don't judge any individual, I'll disagree there. Boomers in general destroyed this country and the Church. While their parents sacrifice to raise Boomers, the Boomers themselves had too few children, out of selfishness, to support themselves in retirement. Where it used to be that there were 20 payers into Social Security for each recipient, it's closing in on 2. That's not sustainable. Naturally, if parents of 6, 8, 10 children, it's much less a burden on those children to help care for them when they get older, since they're only bearing a fraction of the cost or time or effort.
You've got sucked into the Marxist generational clash. The very reason the so-called "baby boomer" generation ended was because of the generation before it starting to take contraceptives.I can’t stand this generational conflict. It’s specifically an American thing because it’s rare here in UK to talk about oh you’re a boomer or boomer mentality. As you said it was the parents of the boomers taking contraceptives that caused them to only have two children on average!! Also WE don’t know what WE would have done (the ones younger than boomers) if we had had their upbringing. Hindsight is a fine thing.
You've got sucked into the Marxist generational clash. The very reason the so-called "baby boomer" generation ended was because of the generation before it starting to take contraceptives.The boomer were raised by the tulmidvision.
Maybe a key in understanding what's really going on here:What was this about?
autistic Perseveration on Injustice
AI Overview
(https://i.imgur.com/XZo3Hi7.jpeg)
Autistic perseveration on injustice happens because a strong sense of fairness meets a neurodivergent tendency to get "stuck" on topics (https://www.google.com/search?q=neurodivergent+tendency+to+get+), leading to intense focus, rumination (circular thoughts), and distress over perceived wrongs, often feeling like a burning need to fix it, even when others seem unbothered. This "justice sensitivity" makes them notice unfairness deeply and struggle to let go, sometimes fueled by their own experiences of being invalidated, making it a powerful, often distressing, cognitive loop.
Why it happens
- Heightened Justice Sensitivity: Autistic individuals often have a strong moral compass and see the world in black-and-white fairness, making injustice feel deeply wrong and unacceptable.
- Cognitive Rigidity: Perseveration, or getting "stuck" on a thought, can focus intensely on the injustice, replaying it and seeking solutions endlessly.
- Intense Empathy & Personal Experience: Having faced their own invalidation, they may intensely feel for others being wronged, creating a powerful drive to speak up and fix it.
- Difficulty Letting Go: Unlike neurotypical responses where people might move on, autistic people can struggle to disengage from the unfair situation, making it feel urgent and consuming.
How it manifests
- Ruminating Loops: Replaying the situation, wanting to say something, or figuring out how to right the wrong, even if it's unproductive.
- Speaking Out: An intense need to call out unfairness, even when inconvenient or uncomfortable for themselves.
- Distress & Overwhelm: Feeling deeply upset and unable to cope with the illogical nature of the injustice.
Managing the loop (https://www.google.com/search?q=Managing+the+loop&client=firefox-b-1-d&hs=sF0o&sca_esv=5832d1ce5a718513&ei=EqtEabWpCY2i0PEPt6n_mA8&ved=2ahUKEwi1sdb1wMiRAxULEzQIHZpTCRwQgK4QegQIBhAA&uact=5&oq=autistic+Perseveration+on+Injustice&gs_lp=Egxnd3Mtd2l6LXNlcnAiI2F1dGlzdGljIFBlcnNldmVyYXRpb24gb24gSW5qdXN0aWNlMgUQIRigATIFECEYoAEyBRAhGKABSIweUNUUWNUUcAF4AZABAJgBmgGgAZoBqgEDMC4xuAEDyAEA-AEC-AEBmAICoALFAcICChAAGLADGNYEGEeYAwCIBgGQBgiSBwMxLjGgB8ADsgcDMC4xuAe0AcIHAzMtMsgHF4AIAA&sclient=gws-wiz-serp&mstk=AUtExfDNRUbv68aIqYYsG0ieiMDv18z_DoLylE3jear11RwV3cMBEaGWB-XdgVlieZUDCBQLbNSy5U31zqGwp9AhE1ykC9M1riMe_ZvbrPBy_BOjOUxa8VJWi4EA81OZCtMHJLA&csui=3)
- Acknowledge & Validate: Recognize it's a real experience, not "overreacting".
- Parking Lot (https://www.google.com/search?q=Parking+Lot&client=firefox-b-1-d&hs=sF0o&sca_esv=5832d1ce5a718513&ei=EqtEabWpCY2i0PEPt6n_mA8&ved=2ahUKEwi1sdb1wMiRAxULEzQIHZpTCRwQgK4QegQICRAC&uact=5&oq=autistic+Perseveration+on+Injustice&gs_lp=Egxnd3Mtd2l6LXNlcnAiI2F1dGlzdGljIFBlcnNldmVyYXRpb24gb24gSW5qdXN0aWNlMgUQIRigATIFECEYoAEyBRAhGKABSIweUNUUWNUUcAF4AZABAJgBmgGgAZoBqgEDMC4xuAEDyAEA-AEC-AEBmAICoALFAcICChAAGLADGNYEGEeYAwCIBgGQBgiSBwMxLjGgB8ADsgcDMC4xuAe0AcIHAzMtMsgHF4AIAA&sclient=gws-wiz-serp&mstk=AUtExfDNRUbv68aIqYYsG0ieiMDv18z_DoLylE3jear11RwV3cMBEaGWB-XdgVlieZUDCBQLbNSy5U31zqGwp9AhE1ykC9M1riMe_ZvbrPBy_BOjOUxa8VJWi4EA81OZCtMHJLA&csui=3): Write down the concerns to address later, freeing up mental space.
- Shift Focus (https://www.google.com/search?q=Shift+Focus&client=firefox-b-1-d&hs=sF0o&sca_esv=5832d1ce5a718513&ei=EqtEabWpCY2i0PEPt6n_mA8&ved=2ahUKEwi1sdb1wMiRAxULEzQIHZpTCRwQgK4QegQICRAE&uact=5&oq=autistic+Perseveration+on+Injustice&gs_lp=Egxnd3Mtd2l6LXNlcnAiI2F1dGlzdGljIFBlcnNldmVyYXRpb24gb24gSW5qdXN0aWNlMgUQIRigATIFECEYoAEyBRAhGKABSIweUNUUWNUUcAF4AZABAJgBmgGgAZoBqgEDMC4xuAEDyAEA-AEC-AEBmAICoALFAcICChAAGLADGNYEGEeYAwCIBgGQBgiSBwMxLjGgB8ADsgcDMC4xuAe0AcIHAzMtMsgHF4AIAA&sclient=gws-wiz-serp&mstk=AUtExfDNRUbv68aIqYYsG0ieiMDv18z_DoLylE3jear11RwV3cMBEaGWB-XdgVlieZUDCBQLbNSy5U31zqGwp9AhE1ykC9M1riMe_ZvbrPBy_BOjOUxa8VJWi4EA81OZCtMHJLA&csui=3): Use calming special interests (music, a hobby) or physical activity as distraction.
- Environmental Changes (https://www.google.com/search?q=Environmental+Changes&client=firefox-b-1-d&hs=sF0o&sca_esv=5832d1ce5a718513&ei=EqtEabWpCY2i0PEPt6n_mA8&ved=2ahUKEwi1sdb1wMiRAxULEzQIHZpTCRwQgK4QegQICRAG&uact=5&oq=autistic+Perseveration+on+Injustice&gs_lp=Egxnd3Mtd2l6LXNlcnAiI2F1dGlzdGljIFBlcnNldmVyYXRpb24gb24gSW5qdXN0aWNlMgUQIRigATIFECEYoAEyBRAhGKABSIweUNUUWNUUcAF4AZABAJgBmgGgAZoBqgEDMC4xuAEDyAEA-AEC-AEBmAICoALFAcICChAAGLADGNYEGEeYAwCIBgGQBgiSBwMxLjGgB8ADsgcDMC4xuAe0AcIHAzMtMsgHF4AIAA&sclient=gws-wiz-serp&mstk=AUtExfDNRUbv68aIqYYsG0ieiMDv18z_DoLylE3jear11RwV3cMBEaGWB-XdgVlieZUDCBQLbNSy5U31zqGwp9AhE1ykC9M1riMe_ZvbrPBy_BOjOUxa8VJWi4EA81OZCtMHJLA&csui=3): Reduce demands, take breaks, use sensory tools (headphones, fidgets) to lower overload.
- Seek Support: Talk to someone who listens, or use tools like anxiety apps.
I can’t stand this generational conflict. It’s specifically an American thing because it’s rare here in UK to talk about oh you’re a boomer or boomer mentality. As you said it was the parents of the boomers taking contraceptives that caused them to only have two children on average!! Also WE don’t know what WE would have done (the ones younger than boomers) if we had had their upbringing. Hindsight is a fine thing.
What are you talking about? Boomers are called Boomers precisely because they were many, so it was not their parents who took the contraceptivers but the Boomers who took the contraceptives. While their parents had many children, they themselves turned around and had very few by comparison....I think the poster you responded to was "girlytrad" the cross-dressing limey who I also suspect was that goat-loving chap who was banned by Matthew a few months ago. They have exactly the same marxist world view.
I think the poster you responded to was "girlytrad" the cross-dressing limey who I also suspect was that goat-loving chap who was banned by Matthew a few months ago. They have exactly the same marxist world view.This was me.
I think the poster you responded to was "girlytrad" the cross-dressing limey who I also suspect was that goat-loving chap who was banned by Matthew a few months ago. They have exactly the same marxist world view.
What are you talking about? Boomers are called Boomers precisely because they were many, so it was not their parents who took the contraceptivers but the Boomers who took the contraceptives. While their parents had many children, they themselves turned around and had very few by comparison.Actually you’re right, about the boomers, I apologise. Boomer years are 1946-1964 and contraception in the form of the pill only became widespread in 1960, so it would have been the boomers themselves taking contraception plus perhaps a few of their parents who had children 1960-64. We don’t talk in generational terms or emphasise the divide as much here in UK as Americans do so I got the dates wrong. I get your point about impossible to say what we’d do if we were black etc but what I meant is, we the younger generations (millennials, Gen X) can see the results of the boomers embracing Vatican 2 for example. We can see how church attendance declined, vocations declined since Vatican 2. But the people supporting the changes at the time couldn’t foresee this. They thought it was a new lease of life for the church, mass in the vernacular was going to somehow encourage people to embrace the liturgy etc etc!! We know now this didn’t happen but they didn’t know. I don’t know if any of that makes sense to you. But you must have made decisions that, with hindsight you know now were unwise?
Nor do I have any clue about why you're handwringing here about what "we" would have done. That has nothing to do with the fact that what they as a group, or a general trend, did was right or wrong (using contraceptivesa is objectively wrong), and everyone obviously knows that not ALL Boomers took contraceptives, and this isn't about assessing blame for any particular individual.
This is nonsensical, like saying that because, oh, there are high crimes rates among Black people, going off on talking about how we don't know what we would have done if we were Black. That has absolutely nothing to do with the observations being made.
AS A WHOLE, STATISTICALLY, AS A GROUP, the Boomers had too few chldren on order to sustain economic growth. That's simply undeniable, and everybody realizes that very many of them did not use contraception or restrict their children, and to the extent that others did, God will judge them ... just like everybody realizes that there are very many Black people who are decent, upstanding, civilized individuals who do not commit violent crimes.
This reminds me of an interview that Bishop Fellay gave (one that Bishop Williamson mocked), where a hostile interviewer called him out for having made statements about how Jews were enemies of the Catholic Church ... and he started dancing, backpedaling, hemming and hawing, to the point that it was pretty embarrassing. You simply say that, "it obviously goes without saying that not ALL Jews are active, dedicated enemies of the Church, but that, generally speaking, the religious views and ideology to which a majority of Jews adhere are inimical to Catholicism. If you were to ask Jews if they are at enmity with the Catholic Church, they would say yes. After all, they believe that the man we accepted as the Messiah is an imposter. It's no different than if I had said that Jews and Muslims are at enmity with one another and at odds, i.e. that Jews and Muslims are enemies ... due to opposing religious and ideological views. We needn't snowflake out and deny reality. If some Jew came up to me and told me that they hated the Catholic Church, I would at least respect their honest statement of their position, rather than if someone danced around it and pretended that it wasn't the case when it really was."
Boomers had 3-4 children on average.I am hoping that the Gen Alpha or whatever the under 16s (my children generation) are known as, will react against the anti child anti family culture and ‘rebel’ by getting married and having bigger families if they can. Perhaps a spiritual change or some miracle will prompt this. 🙏
Later generations toned that down further to 2 children.
The latest generation is going with "no marriage or children" which is why American culture is doomed, dead, DOA at this point.
When a culture can't even guide its "adherents" to successfully repeat the cycle (have a family, have children, and train those children with the same beliefs/culture, so as to eventually replace you) then your culture is as worthless as tits on a bull.(https://www.cathinfo.com/Themes/DeepBlue/images/icons/modify_inline.gif)Heathen cultures all over the world are superior to the current American "culture". At least those pagan, heathen cultures manage to propagate themselves over the centuries. They result in families being formed, children being born, and raised in that culture so it can continue.
Our "culture" has degraded to the point it is suicidal -- self-destructive. It's over.
What was this about?It's about understanding the OP. Observation and interaction over time with the OP (I think we all know who he is) has convinced me that ASD explains in part his difficulties in grasping certain concepts. His seeming inability to have a detached, "big picture", if you will, view of life and his circuмstances. Obvious "autistic looping", i.e. rehashing the same problems over and over.
It's about understanding the OP. Observation and interaction over time with the OP (I think we all know who he is) has convinced me that ASD explains in part his difficulties in grasping certain concepts. His seeming inability to have a detached, "big picture", if you will, view of life and his circuмstances. Obvious "autistic looping", i.e. rehashing the same problems over and over.
I say this not to belittle or humiliate, but in an honest attempt to understand. I don't think that the OP is stupid or bad nor that he should be treated as less of a human being, he's not. I just think that his ASD qualities should be kept in mind and proper allowances made when trying to interact with him. But it's not a one way street. He is also responsible for making a good faith effort to understand not only himself but others. He has to learn to make allowances for others just as much as they do for him.
And, just because I think he's on the spectrum, doesn't mean he's off the hook. He's not an "autist", he's a human being who has what is sometimes a disability. Having autism doesn't mean that one can't also be immature and have a shitty attitude. And it's no lack of charity to say so and push back on those things.
By the way, I am not "girlytrad". I haven't really given any thought to who she (he?) is. As far as Lad being autistic, I could be wrong, but I've never really thought so. I think he just gets carried away sometimes and needs pushback when he does. Who here doesn't?
As far as staying anonymous when the OP himself stays anonymous, what's good for the goose is good for the gander. I can't imagine anyone who's been around here a while not being able to pick up on another regular member's accustomed idiom anyways.
It's about understanding the OP. Observation and interaction over time with the OP (I think we all know who he is)I don't know who he is :laugh1:
I am hoping that the Gen Alpha or whatever the under 16s (my children generation) are known as, will react against the anti child anti family culture and ‘rebel’ by getting married and having bigger families if they can. Perhaps a spiritual change or some miracle will prompt this. 🙏That's only possible of those gen a girls marry an older established man so they can stay at home and raise 10+ children. So the age gap question comes again + the age at which girls can be married.
That's only possible of those gen a girls marry an older established man so they can stay at home and raise 10+ children. So the age gap question comes again + the age at which girls can be married.Unless the gen A boys also step up to responsibility and actually want to marry and remain faithful. No objection to a reasonable age gap eg 10 years but not advisable for anyone to marry before 18. 21 or over ideally. Men especially not before 21. As men mature later than women.
I think the OP is right in the fact that boomers are disconnected from reality. For example, 50 years ago it was much easier to find a job, someone like Matthew wouldn't have any problem finding one. But the job market now is super crazy. You can send out 200 CVs and receive nothing but automated rejections, and not even an interview. You have job offers for "juniors" that require 3 years of experience, and it's almost impossible to find a real junior position; it's completely crazy.The dating market is WORSE than the job market, really set that sink in.
50 years ago, nobody in Spain wanted to be a civil servant because you earn less in the public sector than in the private sector. Now, half of young people spend years studyng for competitive exams, and thousands compete for a civil servant job because in Spain, if you are a civil servant, you have a job for life, you won't be fired if you do your work, and job instability is so high that it's highly desirable.
Saying this isn't complaining, it's just pointing out the reality of the world today.
The same goes for male-female dynamics, I think a lot of they don't understand how much has changed in the last 50 years.
Just my two cents.
I think the OP is right in the fact that boomers are disconnected from reality.
I do wish to love my (future) wife as Christ loved the Church, but I also expect obedience. I won't be compromising on Catholic doctrines, or my (basic) standards for women. I won't buckle under boomer delusion or Jєωιѕн propaganda. But realistically what can I do? Most of the women at my chapel are not ladies I would consider marrying, either because they aren't white, or they are fat, or they have tattoos, or took the covid injection, or they are not feminine or because they don't believe in EENS properly.
No one here is denying the difficulties of life for many right now, nor denied anyone the right to express their frustrations, anxieties, or disappointment. What has been pushed back on is the unrelenting negativity, the refusal to see that there are good things happening in your life. If you tell me that there isn't any good in your life, that is not true, that is not the full reality, it is a practical denial of the Providence of God.Well. I want to clarify that I'm not the OP. I've only posted in this thread with my account, not anonymously.
Also, what has been pointed out are considerations to help one see more clearly the "big picture", e.g. consider how many people did not get a chance at life, how many people do have it far worse than you in the right here and now. Open it up to viewing your situation in the broad scope of history. And I don't mean an idealised fantasy of the past, but the cold, hard realities of daily life for our ancestors.
Also, at the end of the day, does your venting even actually make you guys feel any better, or does it just distort and magnify the problems? I ask this as someone who used to bitch non-stop. After a while, by a grace I think, I realised that the complaining wasn't making me feel better and it certainly wasn't helping me overcome any of the problems in life that I could control. I finally started to see that my attitude was far more corrosive and impossible to bear than any external circuмstance ever was.
I've been labelled a "boomer". On one hand, that doesn't really bother me. If you want to imagine that I'm living the carefree high-life, materially speaking, it just tells me that you know nothing about my actual situation or that of millions of others. There certainly are "boomers" that have it made, again materially speaking. Some of them really earned it; put in a tremendous amount of work and took major risks. Some seem not to have earned it; they had some gravy-job, often in government, didn't work all that hard, retired early with a nice big pension. Some of these people that "have it made" are really kind, generous, and a joy to be around. Some are real assholes that do nothing but complain about everything anyways. What of it? Their attitude isn't conformed to the broader reality any more than the ones who overdo the griping here. And if my choices were that I could be wealthy like them but I had to have that negative attitude or that I could be relatively poor but have an attitude that let's me be grateful for life, I would (and did) choose the latter. I'm happy to be "out of touch".
Like I say, go ahead and call me boomer, but at least be honest enough with yourself to realise that it's, I think the kids call it, a "cope". "Copes" and generalisations are a tempting way to process the difficulties of life, but the long term costs are just too high.
Now I have to go to work. See Ya.
Well. I want to clarify that I'm not the OP. I've only posted in this thread with my account, not anonymously.Author of the post that you quoted.
In fact, what I'm doing is preparing for a civil service exam for a IT technician job in a municipality. Once I get a stable job, I'll see if I can invest in a business or something.
No one here is denying the difficulties of life for many right now, nor denied anyone the right to express their frustrations, anxieties, or disappointment. What has been pushed back on is the unrelenting negativity, the refusal to see that there are good things happening in your life. If you tell me that there isn't any good in your life, that is not true, that is not the full reality, it is a practical denial of the Providence of God.
Also, what has been pointed out are considerations to help one see more clearly the "big picture", e.g. consider how many people did not get a chance at life, how many people do have it far worse than you in the right here and now. Open it up to viewing your situation in the broad scope of history. And I don't mean an idealised fantasy of the past, but the cold, hard realities of daily life for our ancestors.
Also, at the end of the day, does your venting even actually make you guys feel any better, or does it just distort and magnify the problems? I ask this as someone who used to bitch non-stop. After a while, by a grace I think, I realised that the complaining wasn't making me feel better and it certainly wasn't helping me overcome any of the problems in life that I could control. I finally started to see that my attitude was far more corrosive and impossible to bear than any external circuмstance ever was.
I've been labelled a "boomer". On one hand, that doesn't really bother me. If you want to imagine that I'm living the carefree high-life, materially speaking, it just tells me that you know nothing about my actual situation or that of millions of others. There certainly are "boomers" that have it made, again materially speaking. Some of them really earned it; put in a tremendous amount of work and took major risks. Some seem not to have earned it; they had some gravy-job, often in government, didn't work all that hard, retired early with a nice big pension. Some of these people that "have it made" are really kind, generous, and a joy to be around. Some are real assholes that do nothing but complain about everything anyways. What of it? Their attitude isn't conformed to the broader reality any more than the ones who overdo the griping here. And if my choices were that I could be wealthy like them but I had to have that negative attitude or that I could be relatively poor but have an attitude that let's me be grateful for life, I would (and did) choose the latter. I'm happy to be "out of touch".
Like I say, go ahead and call me boomer, but at least be honest enough with yourself to realise that it's, I think the kids call it, a "cope". "Copes" and generalisations are a tempting way to process the difficulties of life, but the long term costs are just too high.
Now I have to go to work. See Ya.
You're right! Your post is "pitch stupidity", but I'm usually too kind to say such things. Thank you for the service.
This is pitch stupidity.
Because it assumes the OP does not see the good in life.
It assumes he is such a moron as to not already have coping mechanisms in place to keep himself happy.
In essence it is a variant of the feminist mind virus that assumes men are idiots and don't know what they are doing. Especially if they are young men. That they are just "angry", and "can't see the good". All of this is utterly dim witted nonsense. Lacking in not only empathy, but more importantly, understanding.
So I have a suggestion. Try to broaden your mind to understand that the men are born to care about justice and to understand it. That many of the times they vent like this, it is to exhort. Clearly the original post was an exhortation. We didnt need you and the other posters to "mother" him. We've all had enough in society of mothering. And I say this knowing you are probably a man.
You're right! Your post is "pitch stupidity", but I'm usually too kind to say such things. Thank you for the service.https://x.com/RyderSelmi/status/2003508266282926583
Young men think that old men are fools, but old men know that young men are fools. - George Chapman
Time teaches us all kid, but it doesn't hurt to try. Eventually, whether you like it or not, you'll come to understand just how right those old people who tried to tell you things were.
I sincerely bid you and all a most Blessed Christmas.
The SSPX and others getting more chummy with the modernist occupants in Rome have more of the lukewarm types. Simply put, they have more attachments to the world.I'd drive all day and pay money to see +Bp. Fellay, Fr. Pagliarini, and Candace Owens perform this!