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Anonymous

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Fatima Prayer banned
« on: August 15, 2013, 06:04:01 PM »
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  • I have a friend who won't say the Fatima prayer during the rosary.  He believes it invalidates the rosary based on the anathema attached to anyone who changes the rosary.  If that isn't odd enough, he also has the priest at his church not using the prayer during public rosary.  Is there any validity to his reason?

    Anonymous

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    Fatima Prayer banned
    « Reply #1 on: August 15, 2013, 06:06:36 PM »
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    Anonymous

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    Fatima Prayer banned
    « Reply #2 on: August 15, 2013, 06:14:46 PM »
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  • According to tradition the rosary was given to us by the Blessed Mother. The Fatima Prayer was also given to us by the Blessed Mother. I see no reason to reject the Fatima prayer, unless you do not believe that the Fatima apparitions were from God.

    Then there are the people who pray a different Fatima prayer which they say was the true Fatima prayer, but it was suppressed, like one of my sedevacantist friends. He prays this after the Glory Be:

    "O my Jesus, forgive us our sins! Deliver us from the fires of hell! Have pity on the souls in purgatory, especially the most abandoned."

    Offline Sigismund

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    Fatima Prayer banned
    « Reply #3 on: August 15, 2013, 08:52:49 PM »
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  • No one has to say the prayer, but suggesting that it invalidated the rosary is just silly.  Even if one does no believe in Fatima, there is nothing wrong with the prayer itself.  
    Stir up within Thy Church, we beseech Thee, O Lord, the Spirit with which blessed Josaphat, Thy Martyr and Bishop, was filled, when he laid down his life for his sheep: so that, through his intercession, we too may be moved and strengthen by the same Spir

    Offline Frances

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    Fatima Prayer banned
    « Reply #4 on: August 15, 2013, 09:22:13 PM »
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  • "Do not pray the Rosary.  Do not pray the Fatima prayer.  Make me happy."--------------- :devil2:
     St. Francis Xavier threw a Crucifix into the sea, at once calming the waves.  Upon reaching the shore, the Crucifix was returned to him by a crab with a curious cross pattern on its shell.  


    Anonymous

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    Fatima Prayer banned
    « Reply #5 on: August 16, 2013, 09:25:08 AM »
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    I have a friend who won't say the Fatima prayer during the rosary.  He believes it invalidates the rosary based on the anathema attached to anyone who changes the rosary.  If that isn't odd enough, he also has the priest at his church not using the prayer during public rosary.  Is there any validity to his reason?


    The Rosary is not a Sacrament, so the question of "invalidating" does not come into play.

    As to leaving it out - I wouldn't presume to know better than the Blessed Mother when it comes to her own chaplet. Ask your friend why he does.

    Offline Capt McQuigg

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    Fatima Prayer banned
    « Reply #6 on: August 16, 2013, 10:05:00 AM »
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  • A better question is not whether the Fatima prayer "changes" the Rosary but what its the correct Fatima prayer.

    ???

    I am seeing different versions.

    Which version was given to the shepherd children by Our Lady?

    That's the real question.  

    The novus ordo apparatus is perfectly okay with changing Our Lord's words of consecration, so they would probably completely rewrite Our Lady's prayers and smirk while doing it.  It took over 40 years to get the words "for all" corrected to "for many".  And then there were the hundreds of other little changes too!

    But, back to the question that really counts.

    Which version was given to the shepherd children by Our Lady?

    Offline Hobbledehoy

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    Fatima Prayer banned
    « Reply #7 on: August 16, 2013, 01:13:08 PM »
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    I have a friend who won't say the Fatima prayer during the rosary.  He believes it invalidates the rosary based on the anathema attached to anyone who changes the rosary.  If that isn't odd enough, he also has the priest at his church not using the prayer during public rosary.  Is there any validity to his reason?


    As someone has already written: the Rosary is not a Sacrament, so issues of validity do not apply.

    The Dominican Rosary, the one most diffused throughout Christendom, consists in praying once the Lord's Prayer and ten times the Angelical Salutation for each of the fifteen Mysteries whilst meditating upon these same Mysteries, which are customarily divided into three: Joyous, Dolorous and Glorious Mysteries. This is the definition given in the Roman Breviary in the Second Nocturn lessons for the Office of the Solemnity of the Most Holy Rosary of the Blessed Virgin Mary.

    In order to gain the indulgences in the Raccolta, this is the absolute requirement, except that you may divide the decades of the Holy Rosary throughout the day as long as you recite five decades within that same day.

    The addition of the Minor Doxology, the antiphon Salve Regina, &c., were added later, under the influence of the Dominican structure of the Divine Office. From the beginning, the Holy Rosary was considered to be the Psalter of Jesus and Mary, so that the 150 Angelic Salutations correspond to the 150 Psalms in the Psalter of King David which form the nucleus of the Divine Office recited by canonical obligation by clergymen, professed Religious, Canons, &c. Later, the Apostolic Symbol and the preliminary Pater and three-fold Ave were added, and the Fatima Prayer was added in the 20th century. Adding these and other prayers do not take away from the Rosary; they are supposed to enhance one's attention and affection whilst continuing or concluding the Rosary.

    Again, the essence of the recitation of the Holy Rosary is the praying of the Lord's Prayer and the Angelic Salutation together with meditation on the Rosary Mysteries.

    I have posted some material that may be helpful: http://www.cathinfo.com/catholic.php/Daily-Rosary

    Please ignore all that I have written regarding sedevacantism.


    Offline Geremia

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    Fatima Prayer banned
    « Reply #8 on: August 17, 2013, 12:45:40 AM »
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    I have a friend who won't say the Fatima prayer during the rosary.  He believes it invalidates the rosary based on the anathema attached to anyone who changes the rosary.  If that isn't odd enough, he also has the priest at his church not using the prayer during public rosary.  Is there any validity to his reason?
    The Fatima prayer is just an additional, pious prayer added to the rosary; it's not essential to the rosary. The bare-minimum prayers necessary for the rosary are the Credo, Paters, Aves, and Gloria Patris. What's wrong with the Fatima prayer, per se? I don't see anything objectionable in it, even if Fatima were not true.
    St. Isidore e-book library: https://isidore.co/calibre

    Anonymous

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    Fatima Prayer banned
    « Reply #9 on: August 17, 2013, 12:49:17 AM »
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    The Rosary is not a Sacrament, so the question of "invalidating" does not come into play.
    Okay, so when is the Rosary no longer the Rosary?

    Would you say that Bugnini's modified, ecumenical Rosary (which, Deo gratias, Paul VI put an end to) is still the Rosary? It was certainly not. Thus, it is an invalid Rosary.

    Anonymous

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    Fatima Prayer banned
    « Reply #10 on: August 17, 2013, 01:08:04 AM »
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    The Rosary is not a Sacrament, so the question of "invalidating" does not come into play.
    Okay, so when is the Rosary no longer the Rosary?


    When you omit to say a considerable portion of the Paters and the Aves or if you don't meditate on the Mysteries at all, at least that's my opinion

    Quote
    Would you say that Bugnini's modified, ecumenical Rosary (which, Deo gratias, Paul VI put an end to) is still the Rosary? It was certainly not. Thus, it is an invalid Rosary.


    This is the first time I've read about this.

    It is not a matter of whether a Rosary is invalid or not, but whether it is well-pleasing before Our Lord and said entirely as a true Rosary according to how Our Lady instructed St. Dominic and in her subsequent apparitions. If you start adding stuff to the point where it distracts the mind from the Mysteries, then it is no longer the Rosary that Our Lady gave to St. Dominic.

    Validity is a term that is best left for the Sacraments.

    EDIT:

    Quote
    If you start adding stuff to the point where it distracts the mind from the Mysteries, then it is no longer the Rosary that Our Lady gave to St. Dominic.


    This does not apply to the Fatima Decade Prayer. This prayer helps direct the will and makes the mind more attentive as to the intention one should have in praying the Rosary and as to the fruit we ought to derive therefrom: the greater glory of God and the salvation of souls.

    - Hobbles


    Anonymous

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    Fatima Prayer banned
    « Reply #11 on: August 17, 2013, 06:51:36 PM »
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    Would you say that Bugnini's modified, ecumenical Rosary (which, Deo gratias, Paul VI put an end to) is still the Rosary? It was certainly not. Thus, it is an invalid Rosary.


    Could you tell us more about the Bugnini Rosary? I have never heard about it before and would like to learn more about it.

    This is Matto. I forgot to click the button.

    Online TKGS

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    Fatima Prayer banned
    « Reply #12 on: August 17, 2013, 07:41:23 PM »
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    I have a friend who won't say the Fatima prayer during the rosary.  He believes it invalidates the rosary based on the anathema attached to anyone who changes the rosary.  If that isn't odd enough, he also has the priest at his church not using the prayer during public rosary.  Is there any validity to his reason?


    Just out of curiosity, does he say the Luminous Mysteries?

    Anonymous

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    Fatima Prayer banned
    « Reply #13 on: August 18, 2013, 03:49:33 PM »
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    Would you say that Bugnini's modified, ecumenical Rosary (which, Deo gratias, Paul VI put an end to) is still the Rosary? It was certainly not. Thus, it is an invalid Rosary.


    Could you tell us more about the Bugnini Rosary? I have never heard about it before and would like to learn more about it.

    This is Matto. I forgot to click the button.


    You can google it.  It's actually more of a dumb change and not an openly heretical change which is why Paul VI didn't go along with the change.

    Besides, instead of changing the rosary, the novus ordites decided instead to strongly discourage its practice.

    Offline Capt McQuigg

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    Fatima Prayer banned
    « Reply #14 on: August 18, 2013, 03:51:45 PM »
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  • Quote from: TKGS
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    I have a friend who won't say the Fatima prayer during the rosary.  He believes it invalidates the rosary based on the anathema attached to anyone who changes the rosary.  If that isn't odd enough, he also has the priest at his church not using the prayer during public rosary.  Is there any validity to his reason?


    Just out of curiosity, does he say the Luminous Mysteries?


     :applause:

    I am curious too!

     

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