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Author Topic: Confession and scrupulosity  (Read 6961 times)

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Änσnymσus

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Re: Confession and scrupulosity
« Reply #90 on: August 15, 2021, 06:16:37 PM »
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  • Today Mass went very well, by the way. I talked to my priest and asked him if he could clarify what he meant by saying that he takes it upon himself and to paraphrase what he said to the best of my memory, he said that priests are trained to basically cut people with conditions like scrupulosity / OCD and so if I wasn't able to confess everything I wanted, including past sins, they've already been absolved which put my mind at ease about that at least.

    However, after receiving Holy Communion while praying in the pew, I'm not sure but I think a very small speck of it might have fallen from my lips on the ground. I don't know if it was actually part of the Eucharist with certainty but got very nervous about that happening and figured I would mention it next week to the priest in confession. Obviously, even if it was a piece of residue from it, it wasn't intentional and I tried my best to make sure something like that didn't happen.

    After Mass was over, I was talking to a friend who also attended the chapel and I was asked a question and I don't know if I technically lied or not. I was asked if I owned a particular item. I stopped and thought a minute, hesitating, and said no. Basically, I wasn't sure if the question was directed at me individually or collectively towards my family members who were also present. A family member does own the item in question but, I personally don't and I clarified that later on after worrying that I might have lied. I felt particularly bad because it happened inside the chapel and so shortly after going to confession and receiving Holy Communion and shortly after what happened in the previous paragraph.

    Additionally, my priest said that as part of my penance, he wants me to try to read a catechism or find something (I think he said that something online was also a suitable alternative but, don't remember with certainty) as to what constitutes mortal and venial sins. I told him I had found a website a while back that which tried to explain the difference but, I found it confusing because there were some of the same sins listed in both categories. I think he wants me to do this by the end of today so, as of posting this, I have a remaining six hours. If anyone could recommend something that fits this criteria, I would be very appreciative. Thank you.


    Änσnymσus

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    Re: Confession and scrupulosity
    « Reply #91 on: August 15, 2021, 07:08:50 PM »
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  • This may be of some help:
    https://archive.org/details/SinAndItsConsequences/page/n7/mode/2up

    P.S. Thank you for praying for me today.


    Offline Angelus

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    Re: Confession and scrupulosity
    « Reply #92 on: August 15, 2021, 08:51:51 PM »
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  • 1. I try to pray in the morning after I wake up and right before I go to bed. About 5 minutes or so each time. Usually they are prayers in my own words as well as other prayers, such as the Our Father, Hail Mary, Glory Be and Oh My Jesus. I strive to say at least one decade of the Rosary as my priest said I should say at least one decade each morning although, admittedly, I often neglect this but I'm trying to do better. As for mental prayer, I often will make acts of contrition if I slip up as well as the prayer that goes "Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, have mercy on me, a sinner."
    2. I really should do more devotional reading more frequently. I have read a lot of the Bible but, I feel as if I've neglected doing so as much as possible. I'm going to look into catechisms and works by Catholic saints. I would appreciate it if you could recommend some, especially if they're already online which would be a lot easier for me than purchasing them due to monetary constraints.

    3. The chapel where I attended Mass only offers it on Sundays and certain holy days of obligation. If I could go to daily confession and daily mass I absolutely would so but, at the moment it doesn't appear to be an option.

    4. I have a brown scapular that's been blessed but I don't think I've actually been enrolled. How would I go about doing that? I haven't heard of the Monfortian Marian consecration before, though.

    Thank you for your Insight. I was actually asked to assist at a High Mass at one point as the Cross Bearer but I'm very shy, kind of get stage fright, and don't want to mess up and embarrass myself which they understand. If there are other ways that can absolve one of venial sins, I would be grateful to know of them. I remember hearing once that holy water can absolve you of venial sins but, I'm not sure if there is a ritual to go about doing it that specifically will absolve venial sins.

    1. Well, regarding prayer, just try to spend a little more time each day. Build up over time. For example, with vocal prayer (Rosary) try to get to at least 5 decades per day, preferably with your family, if possible. Eventually, try to say a full 15 decade Rosary every day. It might take months or years to get there. Mental prayer can just be "talking to Jesus and Mary." Tell them how stupid you have been (as we all have been) and ask for their guidance. Believe that they really are there and that they hear you.

    2. Maybe you should start with the Catechism of Pius X or Baltimore Catechism. I get the feeling that you are just beginning to understand the Catholic faith. Those are available online for free.

    3. Ok. Go to mass as often as possible. I would go to any Tridentine Mass offered by a priest that has been validly ordained. I would not care if independent, Resistance, SSPX, FSSP, ICKSP, Diocesan. If a valid priest says the Tridentine mass, the Eucharist is valid and the mass should be the same.

    4. Ask the priest at your chapel to enroll you in the Brown Scapular. Make sure to read about your responsibilities and the promises associated with it. For the Consecration, buy this book and follow the instructions.

    When I said "assist" at Mass, I meant "attend" mass like any lay person would. You do not need to be an altar server to receive absolution of venial sins. Just attending with the proper dispositions is enough.

    Remember, for YOU to be guilty of mortal sin requires three elements: 1) the act must be a SERIOUS sin as defined by the Church, 2) YOU must KNOW it is a serious sin at the time that you commit it, 3) YOU must INTENTIONALLY choose to commit the sin. If you understand what these three requirements mean, I think you will find that many of the sins you are committing are actually venial. You don't sound like the kind of person who doesn't care about offending God, which is the hallmark of a mortally sinful person. For a typical Catholic, KNOWINGLY and INTENTIONALLY committing a mortal sin should be very rare. Remember, habitual sins are not necessarily mortal if you are trying to avoid them, but you find it hard to stop the bad behavior immediately. So don't beat yourself up if you keep committing that habitual sin for a while. But over time, you should gain more control over those bad habit as more grace comes to you.

    Offline Angelus

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    Re: Confession and scrupulosity
    « Reply #93 on: August 15, 2021, 09:35:44 PM »
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  • Today Mass went very well, by the way. I talked to my priest and asked him if he could clarify what he meant by saying that he takes it upon himself and to paraphrase what he said to the best of my memory, he said that priests are trained to basically cut people with conditions like scrupulosity / OCD and so if I wasn't able to confess everything I wanted, including past sins, they've already been absolved which put my mind at ease about that at least.

    However, after receiving Holy Communion while praying in the pew, I'm not sure but I think a very small speck of it might have fallen from my lips on the ground. I don't know if it was actually part of the Eucharist with certainty but got very nervous about that happening and figured I would mention it next week to the priest in confession. Obviously, even if it was a piece of residue from it, it wasn't intentional and I tried my best to make sure something like that didn't happen.

    After Mass was over, I was talking to a friend who also attended the chapel and I was asked a question and I don't know if I technically lied or not. I was asked if I owned a particular item. I stopped and thought a minute, hesitating, and said no. Basically, I wasn't sure if the question was directed at me individually or collectively towards my family members who were also present. A family member does own the item in question but, I personally don't and I clarified that later on after worrying that I might have lied. I felt particularly bad because it happened inside the chapel and so shortly after going to confession and receiving Holy Communion and shortly after what happened in the previous paragraph.

    Additionally, my priest said that as part of my penance, he wants me to try to read a catechism or find something (I think he said that something online was also a suitable alternative but, don't remember with certainty) as to what constitutes mortal and venial sins. I told him I had found a website a while back that which tried to explain the difference but, I found it confusing because there were some of the same sins listed in both categories. I think he wants me to do this by the end of today so, as of posting this, I have a remaining six hours. If anyone could recommend something that fits this criteria, I would be very appreciative. Thank you.

    Having a speck of the Eucharist falling from your mouth ACCIDENTALLY is not a sin. You cannot be culpable for an act that you did not intend to commit. Even mentioning this in confession is unnecessary.

    Unintentionally saying something that COULD BE interpreted as a falsehood is not a sin. If you were not intending to lie at the time that you said the words, you cannot be culpable for the act.

    Please understand that Jesus wants you to be with Him in heaven. He is not a nitpicker, trying to exclude you from Paradise for making a small mistake or doing something accidentally. Use this guide to discriminate between mortal and venial sins:

    https://www.prayinglatin.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/Examination-of-Conscience-for-Adults.pdf

    Änσnymσus

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    Re: Confession and scrupulosity
    « Reply #94 on: August 16, 2021, 12:50:17 AM »
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  • This may be of some help:
    https://archive.org/details/SinAndItsConsequences/page/n7/mode/2up

    P.S. Thank you for praying for me today.
    Thank you all for praying for me too. I am praying for you all.


    Änσnymσus

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    Re: Confession and scrupulosity
    « Reply #95 on: August 27, 2021, 08:20:26 PM »
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  • I am at a point where I don't think I have or ever can be in a state of grace. There's just no reason to believe any confession I've ever made or will make unless God is completely in control of me during it is valid. I will keep going to confession multiple times a week but will not seek confirmation or Eucharist, this way I'm not guilty of sacrilege. Even though this is obviously not ideal since you should receive Holy Communion at least once a year but sacrilege is a much worse circle in Hell than the alternative. This doesn't seem to be despair because of how it is formulated, but the problem I'm seeing is that I can't have an honest confession at some point if I refuse to receive the Eucharist at least once a year, so then the bad confessions start stacking up. I'm worried this, rather than the aforementioned, will lead me to despair. Anyone else have this issue or a similar one and how to approach it?

    Änσnymσus

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    Re: Confession and scrupulosity
    « Reply #96 on: August 27, 2021, 08:56:08 PM »
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  • I am at a point where I don't think I have or ever can be in a state of grace. There's just no reason to believe any confession I've ever made or will make unless God is completely in control of me during it is valid. I will keep going to confession multiple times a week but will not seek confirmation or Eucharist, this way I'm not guilty of sacrilege. Even though this is obviously not ideal since you should receive Holy Communion at least once a year but sacrilege is a much worse circle in Hell than the alternative. This doesn't seem to be despair because of how it is formulated, but the problem I'm seeing is that I can't have an honest confession at some point if I refuse to receive the Eucharist at least once a year, so then the bad confessions start stacking up. I'm worried this, rather than the aforementioned, will lead me to despair. Anyone else have this issue or a similar one and how to approach it?
    Please do not stay away from Holy Communion. I understand, as much as another person can, how difficult this is for you, but you must abandon yourself to God. Ask your confessor about receiving communion and go when he tells you. Don't be afraid to talk to Jesus the way you are talking to me. Strange as it may sound these difficulties indicate that He is calling you to a special intimacy by requiring a profound humility and complete abandonment to Him.
    Tell yourself, tell Him, I'm not quitting not now not ever no matter what.

    It sounds corny but if it helps listen to things like this to help give you the right attitude:


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    Re: Confession and scrupulosity
    « Reply #97 on: August 27, 2021, 10:28:00 PM »
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  • Please do not stay away from Holy Communion. I understand, as much as another person can, how difficult this is for you, but you must abandon yourself to God. Ask your confessor about receiving communion and go when he tells you. Don't be afraid to talk to Jesus the way you are talking to me. Strange as it may sound these difficulties indicate that He is calling you to a special intimacy by requiring a profound humility and complete abandonment to Him.
    Tell yourself, tell Him, I'm not quitting not now not ever no matter what.

    It sounds corny but if it helps listen to things like this to help give you the right attitude:


    Your point about abandonment seems sound but I'm not Baptized as a Catholic (need a conditional Baptism) and I'm not confirmed so Eucharist is out of reach until at least next year. If receiving with an unclean conscious that doesn't seem like the greatest idea, even if you have a valid point. I think at the very least I will have to wait until those two conditions are met so there are some degrees of "guarantee" and I am not just throwing myself straight into Hell not knowing if I am validly Baptized or not. Doubting my ability to discern anything God is telling me seems safe, perhaps this is an error that prevents progress but it doesn't seem like it will lead me directly into Hell on its own. Believing personal revelation just seems like a slippery slope. Not making progress seems better than slipping into a more dangerous error.


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    Re: Confession and scrupulosity
    « Reply #98 on: August 27, 2021, 10:34:49 PM »
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  • Your point about abandonment seems sound but I'm not Baptized as a Catholic (need a conditional Baptism) and I'm not confirmed so Eucharist is out of reach until at least next year. If receiving with an unclean conscious that doesn't seem like the greatest idea, even if you have a valid point. I think at the very least I will have to wait until those two conditions are met so there are some degrees of "guarantee" and I am not just throwing myself straight into Hell not knowing if I am validly Baptized or not. Doubting my ability to discern anything God is telling me seems safe, perhaps this is an error that prevents progress but it doesn't seem like it will lead me directly into Hell on its own. Believing personal revelation just seems like a slippery slope. Not making progress seems better than slipping into a more dangerous error.
    Have you addressed these things with your confessor? What did he advise you in regards to Baptism?

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    Re: Confession and scrupulosity
    « Reply #99 on: August 27, 2021, 11:25:06 PM »
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  • Have you addressed these things with your confessor? What did he advise you in regards to Baptism?


    On the former point I don't want to establish myself as potentially scrupulous, I want my confessions treated the same as anyone elses. I am a bit afraid to on the latter point. I know that some of the priests at my chapel will ask me about bod if I seem scrupulous on the matter and then I might get the boot and be refused absolution etc. I'm trying to find a chapel that would be safe to ask for a conditional Baptism at where it will be a "no questions asked" affair.

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    Re: Confession and scrupulosity
    « Reply #100 on: August 27, 2021, 11:34:11 PM »
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  • On the former point I don't want to establish myself as potentially scrupulous, I want my confessions treated the same as anyone elses. I am a bit afraid to on the latter point. I know that some of the priests at my chapel will ask me about bod if I seem scrupulous on the matter and then I might get the boot and be refused absolution etc. I'm trying to find a chapel that would be safe to ask for a conditional Baptism at where it will be a "no questions asked" affair.
    Are you the OP of this thread or someone else?

    Quote
    On the former point I don't want to establish myself as potentially scrupulous, I want my confessions treated the same as anyone elses.

    If you are not going to be open and honest with your confessor you will not get anywhere.


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    Re: Confession and scrupulosity
    « Reply #101 on: August 27, 2021, 11:40:49 PM »
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  • Are you the OP of this thread or someone else?

    If you are not going to be open and honest with your confessor you will not get anywhere.
    I am not the OP, but OP did have a problem with confessors because they could tell he was scrupulous. If you were going to SGG and asked for a conditional Baptism with Cekada you'd probably get refused, why is it unreasonable to be afraid of getting cut off from Sacraments?

    Offline Nadir

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    Re: Confession and scrupulosity
    « Reply #102 on: August 27, 2021, 11:55:10 PM »
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  • If you are not baptised then you cannot receive the Sacrament of Penance (Confession).

    You must have received the Sacrament of Baptism in order to receive the Sacraments of Penance or the Eucharist. You do not have to be Confirmed to receive the Sacraments of Penance or the Eucharist. 

    You should be sorting this out with your priest, rather than here where you can be confused with the OP.
    Help of Christians, guard our land from assault or inward stain,
    Let it be what God has planned, His new Eden where You reign.

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    Re: Confession and scrupulosity
    « Reply #103 on: August 28, 2021, 12:21:33 AM »
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  • I am not the OP, but OP did have a problem with confessors because they could tell he was scrupulous. If you were going to SGG and asked for a conditional Baptism with Cekada you'd probably get refused, why is it unreasonable to be afraid of getting cut off from Sacraments?
    The advice given earlier was based on previous experience with the OP and thinking that I was addressing that person. You are a different person with different problems consequently the advice needed may be different. One size does not fit all.
    Scrupulosity is a real problem, trying to hide that from your confessor is a mistake. You are probably not fooling him in the least but there is little that he or anyone else can do if you are not willing to be honest. It's probably difficult for you to recognize it but you appear to be trying to manipulate the Priest and even God himself because you are afraid. I recommend spending as much time as you are able before the Blessed Sacrament. He will help you to have courage.

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